Peugeot- They are now good cars...discuss..

mikey72

Strider590 wrote: »

Peugeot ownership...... My much loved and missed 306.

But as I said above, the drive/performance made it ONLY JUST worth the hassle of owning one.

Everythingh since 2001 (the last 306 GTI, Rallye and 106 GTI) has been far too boring, soft, boat like and OAPish (unless heavily modified).

Hassles are mainly electrical, Peugeot/Citroen/Talbot scrimp on their electrical systems development and crucially on the quality of the wiring and connectors used in the vehicles.... Once they're a few years old, corrosion sets in and near untraceable fault's start appearing, often leading to costly ECU replacements by garages that simply haven't a clue what's wrong with them.

You'll find that as are automotive electronics, particuarly connectors, are built to the same automotive standards, particuarly life tests, they are all near enough indentical across all manufacturers.
And connectors account for about 30% of all failures, across all manufacturers.

Talbot haven't been around as a brand for a while though. Mid eighties I think.

What you're actually saying though, is you were a happy peugeot owner when you were one?

Strider590

mikey72 wrote: »

You'll find that as are automotive electronics, particuarly connectors, are built to the same automotive standards, particuarly life tests, they are all near enough indentical across all manufacturers.
And connectors account for about 30% of all failures, across all manufacturers.

Talbot haven't been around as a brand for a while though. Mid eighties I think.

What you're actually saying though, is you were a happy peugeot owner when you were one?

Is it really necessary to be so pedantic about this?

The performance and handling of the 306 GTI/Rallye was and still is regarded by many (even by modern standards) as the best of ANY hot hatch. The later models simply don't offer that "compensation".

With my car I was actually very lucky by comparison, but then knowing it's failings I was able to look after it properly, I had only a few niggling faults that I couldn't trace.... Like the headlights flickering on/off over bumps/potholes and the alarm sounding randomly without the hazard lights flashing (making it impossible to tell it if was your car until you stood next to it).

Peugeot/Citroen/Talbot (the GROUP, hence the markings on the parts) are well renown for terrible quality connectors and wiring.....
From what I remember, the problem lies with the terminal finishes and the lack of protection against water ingress.
It's well known that you should NEVER try to steam clean the engine bay of a Peugeot/Citroen, I know people who have tried and literally written the car off. An ex recently wrote off her 306 cabriolet by driving through a puddle, it was £1000+ for a new ECU or scrap the car.

You know how the French sometimes refuse to speak English despite most of them being fluent? Well it's as if they refuse to make cars that can survive our climate for the same sort of reason.

Having worked in Automotive electronics, as a quality engineer, I can tell you categorically, quality is a complete joke. Nobody really gives a flying one about quality as long as the paperwork covers their ar5e in the event of a vehicle owner being injured/killed and trying to sue the manufacturer.

It's a very blame culture centred industry, as long as someone else can be blamed, nobody gives a damn and worryingly "silent recalls" happen ALL the time.... You take your car in for it's service at the dealership and they have orders to fix certain serious manufactured faults while it's there, nobody ever finds out, the media doesn't kick up a !!!!!! storm, nobody tries to sue for millions by recreating the fault and damn near killing themselves.

gord115

Generally french cars are more unreliable than others.
Just check out the Autoexpress driver power surveys for proof.
I have owned a few french cars and always had problems with them.
My last was a brand new Citreon xsara(same as a peugeot 306)
After taking it back to the dealers 26 times in 2.5 years I sold it and vowed never to buy a french car again.
I know a few people with french cars and every single one has had problems when I ask them.

(Jeremy Clarkson quote...."the Ford GT must be the most unreliable car on the road unless you know different,in which case write to us at "I own a peugeot ,BBC top gear........")

Crabman

I wouldn't buy a car made in Europe/US. I don't fancy their cheap suspension springs which appear to break regularly.

Suggest you check out Honest John's site as well as Parker's - both have a good spread of reviews with issues to look out for.

mikey72

Strider590 wrote: »

..........Having worked in Automotive electronics, as a quality engineer, I can tell you categorically, quality is a complete joke. ..........

Well, that's something I did for many years oddly enough.
I guess you didn't know about salt spray, accelerated life tests, and ppm, among all the other testing.

Peugeot did drop the Talbot brand in the 80's, I doubt you'll see that name on many parts.
Pedantic maybe, but you're getting confused with the PSA Peugeot Citroen brand.

Strider590 wrote: »

You know how the French sometimes refuse to speak English despite most of them being fluent? Well it's as if they refuse to make cars that can survive our climate for the same sort of reason.

Google "France" and check out where it is on a map.
Parts of it are less than 20 miles away.
The climate is exactly the same as ours, so I reckon they can survive getting wet occasionally.

(Speak french then, I find it works for me)

pendulum

I don't think I'd buy a Renault again purely due to the poor build quality, rattles galore in my 2002 Clio and plenty of niggling electrical problems too, same as my Citroen really, everything important usually works but if something is to go wrong it'll be electrical. I believe 100% that French car wiring, connections, component quality etc is all poor due to a tight budget (and they don't care as long as it outlasts the warranty).

cardinalbiggles

C_Mababejive wrote: »

Am i right in saying the common rail diesel HDI engine is a development between BMW/Mini..?

Common rail was originally a Fiat (FPT) thing, they sold the technology to Bosch who then punted it primarily to VW in TDi guise.

Remember that VW owners when you are spouting nonsense about Fiat

Strider590

mikey72 wrote: »

Well, that's something I did for many years oddly enough.
I guess you didn't know about salt spray, accelerated life tests, and ppm, among all the other testing.

Peugeot did drop the Talbot brand in the 80's, I doubt you'll see that name on many parts.
Pedantic maybe, but you're getting confused with the PSA Peugeot Citroen brand.



Google "France" and check out where it is on a map.
Parts of it are less than 20 miles away.
The climate is exactly the same as ours, so I reckon they can survive getting wet occasionally.

(Speak french then, I find it works for me)

Blah, blah, blah

Edinburgh to Paris 550 miles.

Paris to Barcelona 510 miles

If they have the same weather as us, then so must Spain.

pendulum

They've been putting dodgy electrics in their cars for decades and got away with it and I can't see it changing with the newer models somehow. I can only see it getting worse as they move in to battery powered cars and more complicated electronics. I'd never buy an electric French car for as long as I live.

mikey72

Strider590 wrote: »

Blah, blah, blah

Edinburgh to Paris 550 miles.

Paris to Barcelona 510 miles

If they have the same weather as us, then so must Spain.

You never been to France have you?
Or Spain?