380,000 now on the dole, Including Housing benefit

drc

Wow, that's a surprise...NOT!

drc

How come the Germans can have very specific rules about who is entitled to benefits (they have to have paid into the system) and how long people can stay on benefits (I think it is time limited to one year and is then reduced). If the same EU laws apply to all countries in the Union, why is the UK so hamstrung by laws and rules that the Germans (and French, Spanish etc) don't have to deal with. Surely the UK can just time limit all benefits (except for those that are chronically/terminally ill and disabled or who have paid enough contributions to the system). It seems like financial suicide to continue the way the last government did.

Road_Hog

FTBFun wrote: »

Do you have a link? I thought this would have been widely reported.

It was widely reported, in every national newspaper.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/6418456/Labour-wanted-mass-immigration-to-make-UK-more-multicultural-says-former-adviser.html

As I said many people are 'programmed' and conditioned to believe that anything happening like this is a conspiracy theory. It is very effective, because no one wants to look stupid or a 'nutter'. It works in much the same way as the racism label, people don't speak out against immigration for fear of being branded a racist. It is effective at silencing any dissent.

So, now you have seen (from the link above) that it DOES and IS actually happening, take a look at the post democratic area in my earlier post.

FTBFun

Road_Hog wrote: »

It was widely reported, in every national newspaper.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/6418456/Labour-wanted-mass-immigration-to-make-UK-more-multicultural-says-former-adviser.html

As I said many people are 'programmed' and conditioned to believe that anything happening like this is a conspiracy theory. It is very effective, because no one wants to look stupid or a 'nutter'. It works in much the same way as the racism label, people don't speak out against immigration for fear of being branded a racist. It is effective at silencing any dissent.

So, now you have seen (from the link above) that it DOES and IS actually happening, take a look at the post democratic area in my earlier post.

Err, your link doesn't support this assertion at all:

A year or so ago, the Labour Party admitted opening the gates in order to create and exploit the immigrant vote.

But anyway, perhaps I need to "open my eyes" and not be a "sheeple" because "they" have influenced me.

pqrdef

JonnyBravo wrote: »

"Mr Grayling said: "It is not acceptable that people from other countries can claim our benefits if they have not worked or paid tax in the UK."

Did he? When? Tory Conference 2009? He wasn't saying anything like that on the telly this morning. Because it's irrelevant to the story.

The latest figures are specifically about work-related benefits, so they don't include asylum-seekers and others whose immigration status doesn't allow them to work.

Out of 5.5m claimants of these benefits, 380,000 (6.8%) were foreign nationals when they first applied for an NI number, possibly decades ago. Presumably they had a reason to apply for an NI number. It's unlikely they were on holiday.

A matching exercise (probably a sample) has been carried out between benefits data and immigration data to discover the current immigration status of these claimants. Over half are now British citizens, and almost all of the rest are now known to have legitimate immigration status. Of the residue, it's likely that most haven't yet been matched owing to name changes or data errors. Not many people who are liable for deportation march down to government offices and start filling forms in with their current addresses.

So nothing to see here. But then, this isn't where you'd look.

But it all makes a sufficient excuse (as if they need one) for the Tory rags to print the usual rubbish.

The-Joker

The_White_Horse wrote: »

no. these people contribute nothing compared to what they receive.

unless you meant, they should be contributing in return for their benefits - in which case I agree.

but better they don't get any.

Why not provide work for food. Even cleaning or something.

N,Korea has the right idea get them all busy. They are all out cutting grass with small sissors.

Any way things are heading in the right direction, when the benefits are capped it will be along the right lines.

Road_Hog

FTBFun wrote: »

Err, your link doesn't support this assertion at all:

But anyway, perhaps I need to "open my eyes" and not be a "sheeple" because "they" have influenced me.

It does, you only read the first few lines.

"He wrote: "Earlier drafts I saw also included a driving political purpose: that mass immigration was the way that the Government was going to make the UK truly multicultural."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/nov/10/jurgen-habermas-europe-post-democratic

"To be sure, the liberalisation of values, an increasing willingness to include strangers, and a corresponding transformation of collective identities"

That translates as, accept immigration and forget about your national identity or cultural heritage.

"The supranational expansion of civic solidarity depends on learning processes that can be stimulated by the perception of economic and political necessities, as the current crisis leads us to hope. For the cunning of economic reason has in the meantime at least initiated communication across national borders; but this can condense into a communicative network only as the national public spheres open themselves to each other. Transnationalisation requires not a different news media, but a different practice on the part of the existing media. The latter must not only thematise and address European issues as such, but must at the same time report on the political positions and controversies evoked by the same topics in other member states."

That translates as, globalisation, lying about how they're going to achieve (a like NuLab lying over immigration) and getting the media to put out the propaganda message.

Still, you go believing that all of this is happening naturally by chance and is not in anyway being engineered.

Sapphire

MRSTITTLEMOUSE wrote: »

We need to close our borders and start looking out for our own instead of watering down what we do have to the detriment of our own population.

We need to give the indigenous population a better education to prepare people for work – to teach school pupils that they usually need to start right at the bottom in work, perhaps on a pittance of a salary and perhaps trying out different low-level jobs (I did that myself and it was incredibly useful), and work their way up; to present themselves properly at interviews; to speak and dress properly and have a good ability to read and write; to show respect in their dealings with others; to work diligently and very hard to get anywhere in life. That's the way it's worked for previous generations, who were not part of an 'entitlement culture' of the kind we have now (they had to work to support themselves).

The fact is that many immigrants are more employable than school and college leavers in the indigenous population – which was spoiled rotten during labour's tenure in office and now has a massive sense of entitlement. On the Continent people are still taught respect and manners by their families and in their schools – which by no means always happens in Britain. This can make them much more desirable as employees than bolshy and demanding youth from the indigenous population. Sad but true. :cool:

Road_Hog

pqrdef wrote: »

But it all makes a sufficient excuse (as if they need one) for the Tory rags to print the usual rubbish.

Nope, it's part of the 'programming' create a news story that creates a furore and get the people whipped up. Then announce your new policy (that you've had in the pipeline for ages) to a public that is now largely receptive to changing the benefits system because it's being abused.

It's done all the time.

pqrdef

The_White_Horse wrote: »

no. these people contribute nothing compared to what they receive.

unless you meant, they should be contributing in return for their benefits - in which case I agree.

What, just the foreigners? I'd have thought you'd want to apply that to the whole 5.5 million.

Even the ones who're half dead. Drag them out of their hospital beds and make them contribute.