Scottish Independence

mo786uk

I do not have a problem with scotland going seperate but if they do then they shoudl be totally seperate.

I think though whe nit comes down to the vote they wil lvote to stay as part of the UK.

youropinioncounts

CoolHotCold wrote: »

First thing

Scot here, against independence for a few good reasons.

1) Alex Salmon is a devious goit who couldn't be trusted to keep the tax powers Scotland had under control (and hid this fact for several months/years from Scottish parliament)

Alex Salmond and the SNP kept A+E departments open when labour wanted to shut them got rid of tolls on the roads just to mane a few promises he kept to the Scottish people, granted they should have told parliament about it but the power has never been used by any party.


2) Scotland could well be denied the use of sterling by the BoE and Westminster and forced into Euroland

So why is this union so great if the BOE will do that? 5 million less people using Sterling will weaken it, this is blatand scaremongering by the unionists.


3) Scotlands Oils are not unlimited (about 78% has been taken already) and basing a economy on fluctuating Oil revenues that will extinguish is a bad strategy.

It is not 78% their is at least another 40 years left that we know of i believe it is far more than that so based on the fact they have o nnly been drilling for 30 years it is more like 40% based on the above figures.

4) Scotland would have to rely on the English Armed forces to protect them, unless Scotland wants to spend billions creating it's own usless army.

It has already been stated we will have our own army, navy and air force. We will be part of Europe so therefore be granted protection from all european forces not just the English.


5) The legal and constitutional issues over the Oil fields could be held up in Parliament (Both English/Scottish & Euroland) for decades with Scotland never seeing a penny.

As mush as the unionists like to scraremonger again on this issue Scotland has international law on its side when it comes to this, the oil fiels will be Scottish terriotry after independence.


6) Scotland is not a thriving economy, and without oil money makes us look little better in growth and prospects than Greece. (Alex Salmonds, City of Edinburgh finance is here because it's operated under the UK controls and backed by UK controls, expect relocation (especially if Scotland is forced into Euro territory )

I dont believe they will relocate. This is the same scaremongering from the 70's and 90's that companies will abandon Scotland if we voted for a parliament, what happended to that?


7) Scotland would genuinely be worse off overall by splitting the union and even if it was better, Alex Salmond is not the right person to sail full steam ahead regardless of what everyone else is doing.

Why is Salmond the wrong person? he is not just the best politition in Scotland but the UK.


So to sum up, you probably got I dislike Alex, the Euro and Scotlands independence. But think about how the NHS would operatate (would we still have a NHS), how do we operate monetary policy, Scotland has to take on 200Billion of debt (but it should actually be several times larger if Alex Salmond didn't have selective memory loss), Loss of Sterling, uncertanty, growth stalling, Legal uncertainties to Oil fields, Legal issues about leaving the union, fishing, foreign policy.

We would still have the NHS. We would have i would imagine a central bank for monettary policy. We can manage our share of the debt. We will only lave sterling in a referendum on whearhter to join the Euro. why would growth stall? why does Westminister not give us the legal right to hold the vote, fishing and forign policy we would finally have a say on under the union a English MEP disucces that while we sit in the corridor.


Plus the thousands and thousands of new jobs needed to be created on the public sector (which Scotland already has the largest in the UK) to take on duplicate roles of Tax & Customs, Prision service, etc etc, essentially everything currently handled by Westminster would need a duplicate title and job here in Scotland.

Most department that operate in Westminister have offices up here so they would just need to be improved, only things like the DVLA would need started from sctratch. Why are you against jobs comming to Scotland?



Oh and I forget, Alex wants 16 and 17 year olds to be allowed to vote (Now thats just skewing the voting in favor of him) and complicate the ballot to 3 choices because he knows he can't win a Yes / No.

There were plenty of MP's that voted in favour of 16 and 17 year olds to vote in the AV referendum, why should it be diffrent for a Scottish referendum? I dont agree with a third option it should be yes/no to independence.


Considering how much rigging the vote he's being trying to do in public I wouldn't put it past him to do it in secret.

Their has been no rigging, it would be illegal to do so.

Do you not know that Westminister rigged the vote in 1979?

youropinioncounts

CrazyClum wrote: »

Think it will be the death of the country, will end up with an economy like Greece.

(Scottish living in England - can definitely differentiate a huge difference in the local economies)

What are you basing this on? the scaremongering from the unionists?

Scotland would be the sixth richest country in the world, fact.

This is usual scaremongering from unionists that we will end up like Greece, Ireland and Iceland. Heard it all before and all lies.

youropinioncounts

mo786uk wrote: »

I do not have a problem with scotland going seperate but if they do then they shoudl be totally seperate.

I think though whe nit comes down to the vote they wil lvote to stay as part of the UK.

I hope we get total independence as well.

I will despair if the Scots dont take this chance to make our lives better.

youropinioncounts

The_Unready wrote: »

That's not actually true, though, is it?

In the Constituency Vote in May 2011 the SNP picked up 45.39% of votes from people who bothered to vote.

Overall turnout was 50%

That means that the SNP picked up less than 23% of the total possible votes.

In the Regional Vote they got even fewer votes.

Not quite fitting of the description "most", is it?

Just another minority party with big ideas and delusions of grandeur.

The Unready

The SNP gained 32 constituencies, twenty two from the Scottish Labour Party, nine from the Scottish Liberal Democrats and one from the Scottish Conservatives. Such was the scale of their gains that, of the 73 constituencies in Scotland, only 20 are now represented by MSP's of other political parties

They got 44% of the list vote (regional vote) hardly far less as you say.

The SNP got more of a landslide that Labour got in 1997 under Tony Blair.

Look at the map they got "most" votes, hardly a minority party.

They achieved a majority government in a PR system designed to stop it.

oldagetraveller

Let them be TOTALLY independent if the Scottish people so wish. So vote yes by all means. But you have to be on your own if you do.
Only if it means they are completely independent with everything. Their own armed forces, their own passports, no hand outs or help from the then severed remainder of the Union etc.
So get on with it. You'll soon be back with cap in hand!
Oh, that Scottish oil. It might come ashore in Scotland but if you follow the line of the Scotland, England border into the North Sea, think again. Does Scotland "own" the North Sea? Surely the oil is the oil company's?

Azari

One thing is for sure.

Virtually all the risks are for the Scots.

The UK losing less than 10% of its population and, with it, the need to provide more funds for an area than it gets back in taxes is likely to be, financially, at least, beneficial.

The outlook for the Scots, on the other hand, is a lot more uncertain:

They would move from being part of one of the worlds largest economies to one of the smallest.

They would suffer a net loss to their funding whilst at the same time needing to provide the top management and control of a whole swathe of services currently shared with the rest of the UK and would suffer massively as the lost many economies of scale.

Their voice in Europe would be little more than a squeak.

tight_scotsman

it should be a yes /no vote nothing else and that little knob salmond wont have a Y/N vote because he know he would be beaten hands down

since this is someting affecting the whole of the uk then all of the uk should get to vote Y/N scotland ,england, wales and nothern ierland

by what you hear on radio,tv, press ,it sounds ike the rest of the uk want shot of us anyway.

salmond will have braveheart on tv continuisly on a loop as well as the time the scots demolished wembley after beating them at football.during his campain.

i personally will vote no.

the only reason scots voted snp last time was the others were even more useless:beer:

The_Unready

youropinioncounts wrote: »

They got 44% of the list vote (regional vote) hardly far less as you say.

Please read that bit of my post again - I didn't use the term "far less"!

Look at the map they got "most" votes, hardly a minority party.

Collins on-line dictionary definition of "most":

"a great majority of; nearly all"

Result of Scottish elections 2011 (Constituency Vote):

Total Electorate - 3,978,444 (approx)

Electorate who voted for the SNP - 902,915 = 22.7%

Electorate who did not vote for the SNP - 3,075,529 = 77.3%

So, for every 1 person eligible to vote who voted for the SNP, there were nearly 3½ people eligible to vote who didn't vote for them.

Not quite "most", is it?

The Unready

SwanJon

I'm not Scottish. but have lived here half my life. Obviously the next 30 months are going to be full of debate on this, but hopefully it will be informed debate, not just pushing for people to vote with their guts.
For example:

youropinioncounts wrote: »

I praise the SNP for giving the Scottish people the right to vote on this, all the unionist parties refused this democratic right when they had the balance of power.

At no election in Scotland (in the last 300 years) have a majority of the electorate voted for a party supporting a referendum. Why should it be a good thing for the SNP to keep their promises while expecting other parties to break theirs?
The same thing came up when the SNP won their first election - some people thought that the LDs should forgo their manifesto pledge and form a coalition with the SNP.

AS's continued use of 'England' when he talks about the UK I find personally offensive (I'm Welsh) - especially as he is deliberately using it to drive the anti-English sentiment into a pro-independence one.

I know how I'd vote now, but the pro-independence lobby have 30 months.