School have banned the word "christmas"!!!

margaretclare

Welshwoofs wrote: »

Ahh well I'm an atheist so I'm afraid to say that I have a complete downer on the whole religious aspect of christmas too. I do call it christmas; only because it's overly pedantic to call it something that 99% of people don't, but it has zero religious meaning to me and let's call a spade a spade - it is a day highjacked from the pagans.

Yes, I know, but as I've already said somewhere else, at least the pagans don't call it Christmas. They call it Yule. So, be consistent with your own beliefs. You don't believe in Christ, so don't call it Christmas. I don't quite know what atheists do believe in - difficult to believe in a negative? But the pagans do have strong beliefs, at least the ones I know have, they know what they believe in, and I can respect that. http://wodensfolk.org.uk/woden.htm

Person_one

margaretclare wrote: »

Yes, I know, but as I've already said somewhere else, at least the pagans don't call it Christmas. They call it Yule. So, be consistent with your own beliefs. You don't believe in Christ, so don't call it Christmas. I don't quite know what atheists do believe in - difficult to believe in a negative? But the pagans do have strong beliefs, at least the ones I know have, they know what they believe in, and I can respect that. http://wodensfolk.org.uk/woden.htm

Atheists believe in all sorts of different things, its not a club! They don't necessarily have anything in common besides lack of belief in deities.

I might be reading your posts wrong but are you saying that you can't respect people if they don't believe in a god, any god?

Brighton_belle

margaretclare wrote: »

I don't quite know what atheists do believe in - difficult to believe in a negative?

How about joy, goodness, the kindness of others, the infinite capacity of humans to grow, learn, love, cherish, share,the value of life, the value in another human being, the beauty and wonder of nature, the right to be free and to love whom you choose and to have enough to eat, clean water to be able to keep warm and to have a safe roof over your head. This is what this atheist believes in.
The absence of a deity is not a negative;it is not a hole of longing waiting to be filled. It is nothing therefore there is no absence.

Person_one

Brighton_belle wrote: »

How about joy, goodness, the kindness of others, the infinite capacity of humans to grow, learn, love, cherish, share,the value of life, the value in another human being, the beauty and wonder of nature, the right to be free and to love whom you choose and to have enough to eat, clean water to be able to keep warm and to have a safe roof over your head. This is what this atheist believes in.
The absence of a deity is not a negative;it is not a hole of longing waiting to be filled. It is nothing therefore there is no absence.

Well, you can't really say that. Atheists don't subscribe to a common belief system.

Some might believe what you said, some might believe that aliens are secretly running the banks, or that life is random and cruel and there's no point being nice to anybody.


(Edit, oops, I'm an idiot, I thought you said 'this is what atheists believe in' but now I see you were only referring to yourself so my post is pointless! Sorry!)

esuhl

margaretclare wrote: »

So, be consistent with your own beliefs. You don't believe in Christ, so don't call it Christmas.

But why (and how) am I supposed to determine with any certainty whether Christ existed before I am allowed to use the word "Christmas"? And what other criteria am I required to fulfil in order to use that word? Must I believe that Christ was the son of God? Do I have to believe in the teachings of Christ and Christianity as whole, or more specifically in Church of England interpretations?

What should non-Christ-believers call it? And how would the dual-naming work? If I visit a Catholic household and they keep referring to Christmas, should I keep correcting them and referring instead to "mid-winter, present-giving family day"? Should public signs to Christmas be replaced with the dual names?

(Sorry - question overload!)

margaretclare wrote: »

I don't quite know what atheists do believe in - difficult to believe in a negative?

I presume you don't believe in any of the hundreds of other gods that some people believe in. Well, I just believe in one less god than you.

I believe in all sorts of things (that corporeal reality exists, that solipsism is false, and that the compatibilist theory of determinism is true, for example), but atheism isn't about "believing in a negative"; I simply accept that I don't know how or why the universe exists.

You must be quite happy to believe in such negatives too. Or can you tell me why God permits suffering in the world, or why (since he is supposedly omniscient) he would create the devil?

margaretclare wrote: »

But the pagans do have strong beliefs, at least the ones I know have, they know what they believe in, and I can respect that. http://wodensfolk.org.uk/woden.htm

You can respect people that have a strong belief in something that (you think) is wrong and turn away from God, but you can't respect people who use logic to determine their beliefs?!

Humphrey10

margaretclare wrote: »

I don't quite know what atheists do believe in - difficult to believe in a negative?

I don't believe in any imaginary creature - pixies or faires or flying elephants or green dogs or elves or trolls, why should your imaginary creature that you call God be any different? Do you have equal difficulty understanding why people don't believe in faires etc?

pinksleepybear

The OP has already asked that the thread stay on track and not end up as bickering.

Person_one

pinksleepybear wrote: »

The OP has already asked that the thread stay on track and not end up as bickering.

Its not so serious or personal an issue that a bit of discussion around the subject is inappropriate.

We'll get back on topic when there's an update, I'm sure.

halibut2209

Yeah, this is becoming a yawnfest very quickly.

ab.da54

Person_one wrote: »

Yeah I suppose. I bet that wasn't all of them though, what Christmas parties have you been to where they serve parsnips and sprouts!

Did you spend ages looking at the hoardes of trollies, to see the parsnips and sprouts?