Student Debt on MoneyBox Live BBC4 RUBBISH!!

setmefree2

iclaudius wrote: »

But you all appear to have lots of information so I'd like to at least try to learn something here.

To get you up to speed Things you won't learn about the UK student loan system from the MSE guide and Moneybox.

• The Terms and Conditions of student loans are not fixed. Future governments can alter them. There is no guarantee that a future government will write student loans off or even keep to the interest rates that a student thinks they are signing up for. Nor is there any guarantee that a future government would not introduce penalties for over payments.
• The government intends to sell the UK student loan book to the highest bidder. Some MPs have suggested that the govenment may have to alter the terms and conditions of existing student loans in order to achieve this sale.

devildog

Let's give 'future' students some credit here. They are doing research and forming their own opinions, that doesn't mean as parents we agree/or are happy with their decisions but it is THEIR decision. We do have to appreciate though that a youngster will see things through rose coloured glasses, as parents we have the benefit of life experiences, ups and downs and we have 'earned' the right to be apprehensive/worry.
My 'returner' has done research and is 'happy' (I use the term very loosely)to take on the debt which fills me with horror but it is not my decision to make.

Lokolo

devildog wrote: »

Let's give 'future' students some credit here. They are doing research and forming their own opinions, that doesn't mean as parents we agree/or are happy with their decisions but it is THEIR decision. We do have to appreciate though that a youngster will see things through rose coloured glasses, as parents we have the benefit of life experiences, ups and downs and we have 'earned' the right to be apprehensive/worry.
My 'returner' has done research and is 'happy' (I use the term very loosely)to take on the debt which fills me with horror but it is not my decision to make.

And that makes you a great parent.

setmefree2

Lokolo wrote: »

And that makes you a great parent.

And that makes the rest of us what exactly?????

setmefree2

iclaudius wrote: »

It's apparent that people are on 'sides' in this forum so I'm not going to spend a lot of time trying to change minds.

Yup. The parents with kids going to Uni in 2012 (and soon after) are on one side. The lecturers, reseachers and everyone else with no kids are on the other..... I guess that tells you something....

Amongst other things you will be called an interfering and controlling parent. The student loan cheerleaders would much rather you left your kids alone so they can be brainwashed without incumbrance.....

Lokolo

setmefree2 wrote: »

And that makes the rest of us what exactly?????

Hell I don't think you're a bad parent, I just don't think you are being a great parent but not letting your children make their own decisions.

As I said before, advise them by all means but don't force them to do what you want.

setmefree2 wrote: »

Yup. The parents with kids going to Uni in 2012 (and soon after) are on one side. The lecturers, reseachers and everyone else with no kids are on the other..... I guess that tells you something....

Amongst other things you will be called an interfering and controlling parent. The student loan cheerleaders would much rather you left your kids alone so they can be brainwashed without incumbrance.....

There's a difference between leaving them alone, advising them and forcing them though. By all means, you come on here, say you think the loans are terrible, you are going to advise your children you don't want them to, but you will give them the money, help them make a decision, then great, thats brilliant parenting, as shown in devildog's post.

Telling them, you are not to take a loan is a nice gesture, but surely they aren't learning anything or making their own choice then??

devildog

LOL I really do not feel like a great parent, feel pretty sh*te to be honest.
I am totally against the new fees and taking the loans and believe the system is 'unfair' on many counts and no matter how many times I try and come up with a better way of the Government doing it-I can't, there are always winners and losers.
Equally I am not 'happy' that returner thinks that this level of debt is OK and I will do everything possible to ensure that they borrow as little as possible(even if it means eating baked beans for the next 3/4 years)
I guess what I am saying is, that as parents we have every right to be justifiably concerned and to a degree I can see both sides points of view. But because I can see both sides that doesn't mean I am 'for' these levels of debt. I don't believe either that the parents here against the debt will ultimately 'make' their offspring turn away from uni they are simply trying to advise 'what's best'.
Ultimately it is down to the future student themselves though.

kayr_2

I don't think people need to be so polarised in their views on here!
OK people like SMF2 and 2sides may express their views robustly at times but I really don't think they are intent on controlling their children as they are accused of - surely they are just understandably concerned about the situation and want to explore ways to help?
On the other "side", equally robust views have been expressed which I think are rather unjustified e.g.

I can only assume that you feel threatened by the idea that students from families where their parents cannot pay the thousands of fees upfront should be able to go to university and compete with your pampered offspring for graduate jobs. It obviously is still the case that the wealthy look after their own and couldn't care less about anybody else.

I don't see why caring for your children is described rather pejoratively as "pampering" and I've never got the impression any of the parents on here don't want "poor people" to go to university. They are concerned about their children and what's wrong with that?

I don't get why there seems to be such misinterpretation of "opponents" views on here. I sometimes agree and disagree with nearly everyone in these discussions but don't feel the need to get "robust" about it. We are all different with different circumstances and want to find the best way forward in uncertain times.

Student finance (and life) is becoming more and more complex and uncertain so there isn't an easy answer. I wish we could have a less aggressive discussion about it.

setmefree2

Lokolo wrote: »

Hell I don't think you're a bad parent, I just don't think you are being a great parent but not letting your children make their own decisions.

As I said before, advise them by all means but don't force them to do what you want.



There's a difference between leaving them alone, advising them and forcing them though. By all means, you come on here, say you think the loans are terrible, you are going to advise your children you don't want them to, but you will give them the money, help them make a decision, then great, thats brilliant parenting, as shown in devildog's post.

Telling them, you are not to take a loan is a nice gesture, but surely they aren't learning anything or making their own choice then??

Ha Ha Lokolo luckily I don't give a flying hoot what you think! I know I'm a great parent because a)my kids tell me b) my OH tells me c) and others tell me - even my MIL !!!!

As I said, reducing this thread to insults about people's parenting skills is so so poor.....

The_One_Who

setmefree2 wrote: »

"our own circumstances" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So? I do know plenty of people who are going through the system. Granted, none of these people are affluent enough to pay their fees upfront and so will have to take the loan regardless.

No system is perfect and there will always be winners and losers. The best we can do is try to work within it. Again, that goes for everything, not just student loans.

setmefree2 wrote: »

Insult number one.

It wasn't an insult, it was helpful advice. The multi-quote option is there for a reason.