Fischer Storage Heaters

Xbigman

If a salesman has claimed that Fischer electric heaters will work out cheaper than an existing gas central heating system I'd think you'd have an excellent case for mis selling. Especially with the GCH system still in place.
Make a complaint (or rather get your parents to make one) and demand a refund. 15k is a lot of money and its well worth a battle over.




Darren

jamstac

Richie-from-the-Boro wrote: »

The long term cast will unfortunately be many multiples of the above. I reproduce a very recent answer I made to another MSE'r just minutes ago below :

Your advice on actua hands on use use as a householder is invaluable and will I'm sure be seen by others who might avoid the experiences you have had.

The increased electricity costs and reduction in comfort levels would be my biggest fear.

Volume in kW hours will be similar to NSH, the scary difference is your parents will be paying 30-50% more than their E7 tariff.

Again, thanks for feedback to MSE users.

macman wrote: »

In addition to which, their heating bills will probably increase by about 300% compared to gas at a third of the price of single rate electricity. Tell them to carry on using the gas CH.
For £15K they could have had 3 brand new central heating systems!

Xbigman wrote: »

If a salesman has claimed that Fischer electric heaters will work out cheaper than an existing gas central heating system I'd think you'd have an excellent case for mis selling. Especially with the GCH system still in place.
Make a complaint (or rather get your parents to make one) and demand a refund. 15k is a lot of money and its well worth a battle over.




Darren

Thanks for all of your messages.



Heres a little update just to show how much electricity these systems use:


I went down to my parents today and looked through all the paper work. It showed what their electricity meter reading was on the day the heaters were installed. So I checked what is was today (exactly 2 weeks since installed) and it showed a usage of 1273 kwh :eek: based on their E-on tariff this has cost them for 2 weeks worth of electricity £199.35p :(


Just to double check this, while I was there at their home, for one hour, they had used 5 kwh of electricity.


Their previously quarterly bill (Aug, Sept, Oct) had showed an electricity usage of 997 kwh, less than what they have used in 2 weeks since these heaters were installed.



Luckily due to them still having a gas central heating system we decided it would be better to turn off all the Fischer heaters, bleed all the radiators in the home, and higher up their GCH system from their current 60 F (shocked to find that they had them set this low) to 74 F. Since i've been home I have called them and they advise that their house feels much warmer.


Please if anyone is reading this thread wondering if they should get these heaters please please rethink not only due to the initial outlay but the cost of your electric will sky rocket

Richie-from-the-Boro

Preventing avoidable deaths this winter GOV UK

- note this still stands, next review due Aug this year

- previously we had recommended a minimum temperature of 21°C for living rooms and 18°C for bedrooms but we now advise that people heat their homes to at least 18°C (65F), with some additional nuancing of that advice for vulnerable groups and healthy people

jamstac

Richie-from-the-Boro wrote: »

Preventing avoidable deaths this winter GOV UK

- note this still stands, next review due Aug this year

- previously we had recommended a minimum temperature of 21°C for living rooms and 18°C for bedrooms but we now advise that people heat their homes to at least 18°C (65F), with some additional nuancing of that advice for vulnerable groups and healthy people

Thanks for this advice. I will get them to keep lowering each day until they find the temperture that works for them

jamstac

Just seen this in a leaflet in my parents sales pack:


"with the rising energy costs and colder winters, its no wonder people see the need to cut their energy bills but still want to be warm and comfortable. The only way to achieve this is by using less energy and only heating the rooms you need."



"our radiators have been put through a comparative test by BRE to show how our radiators differ in energy use against Creda night storage heaters, Dimplex Quantum and gas central heating."


In their manual it then says that in this BRE test that Fischer Future Heat cumulative Power for 1 day is 30 kwh and the central heating system is 45 kwh, which obviously makes it look like Fischer uses less, however their is no talk of the cost difference between these two figures. If I times these figures by avg 30 days and then calculate them against my parents E-on tariff the cost difference between these two is £140 p/m for Fischer Heat while the Gas Central Heating system would cost £47 p/m. Not even close to any saving of cost. Also I wish the kwh for Fiscer only came out at 30 kwh a day, in my parents case it came out at 82 kwh per day after i deducted their normal everyday electric usage.



They also talk about another test by BSRIA which "demonstrate that our heaters are low input when consuming electricity" which then goes on to say that their heater during 16 hour test period used 14.05 kwh total power. This is all good if you only use one of these heaters in your home but when you 7 then obviously this is far more.

interestedinsavings

The BRE report conclusion states: 'For both steady state and day / night operation, all four electrical systems draw power at between 69 and 74W per degree temperature difference between the inside of the apartment and the outside, with an average value of 71.4 W per degree. This represents a range of -3% and +4% around the average, within the limits of experimental error, and cannot be attributed to any difference in efficiency between the electrical heating systems'


So BRE confirm that all of the electric heating systems on this test - Creda Night storage, Dimplex Quantum, Premier Radiators & Fischer Future Heat all have the same efficiency.


The Creda and Dimplex models will of course use night time cheap rate electricity and therefore cost less to run

Jim_C_Wilson

Worth pointing out, I think, that you CAN run Fischer heaters on Economy 7. We have one Fischer heater (overpriced) in the hall, and it uses Economy 7 electricity during the night (our other heaters are Creda storage - glad we kept them).
I must add that Fischer is one of the worst companies we have ever dealt with (and I'm 71 this year).

interestedinsavings

They can only run on economy 7 in the same way as any other electric heater, if you happen to want heat between midnight and 7 am. They do not store heat for later use

nigelbb

Xbigman wrote: »

If a salesman has claimed that Fischer electric heaters will work out cheaper than an existing gas central heating system I'd think you'd have an excellent case for mis selling. Especially with the GCH system still in place.
Make a complaint (or rather get your parents to make one) and demand a refund. 15k is a lot of money and its well worth a battle over.

+1

This sounds more like fraud than simple mis-selling. You really need to get Trading Standards onto this.

Jim_C_Wilson

Good Point. But we have Economy 7 until 8.10 am, so I have the heater on from 6.00 until 9.00. It stays warm until 10.00 am (less time than we'd anticipated).
Main point, though, I wouldn't buy another one.