MSE News: Costs to soar in Airmiles revamp: use points before they devalue

Any

malkie76 wrote: »

I think Doc N's analogy is fair, but actually agrees with the airmiles change in policy perfect - ie that fees are not included in funeral plans.

Taking Co-Op for example;



(taken from a PDF on their website - I'm pretty sure you aren't allowed to link to PDFs on this website for security reasons)

Really? Well, I cannot see any sense in the comparison.. Given that Coop PROMISES for the price of the funeral not to change (apart from fees as you pointed out), which Airmiles NEVER did.

Also - following your argument - the fees clause was in the original contract with Coop you signed, not changed later on and therefore changing something you already bought, so the argument would be if CHANGE in sold item that was sold as covering the full lot would be permitted (as supposingly it wouldn't if Coop gave you lifetime guarantee it won't, unlike T&C of Airmiles... )

The argument is completely different, if Coop sold you promise of no change and then incorporated fees into it (ie extra cost) there would be breach of contract/misseling, and not like Airmiles who said from day 1 that it can change...

Spyder15

I've been trying all morning using as many combinations of dates as possible (up to 50 weeks time) to try and book a return flight to anywhere in Australasia and still cannot seem to find a flight.
I have nearly 16500 airmiles and thought I'd use 10000 of them to book a flight now rather than pay what looks like more under the revamped scheme. Thats if I can ever find a flight of course.
Surely booking for any dates at any times could not be more flexible and yet I still can't find any. Surely they are not all taken already - amazing. Thanks Airmiles
ps - now I can't even get onto the Airmiles website as they must be so busy - fiasco springs to mind.

malkie76

I think you'll find that using airmiles to australia is near on impossible. There are only a few seats released, and these usually go within minutes of being available.
The people who want them will be online at 2am when they are loaded into the system and bag them immediately.

Spyder15

malkie76 wrote: »

I think you'll find that using airmiles to australia is near on impossible. There are only a few seats released, and these usually go within minutes of being available.
The people who want them will be online at 2am when they are loaded into the system and bag them immediately.

Thanks - its those kind of tips that I need to know about. Oh well maybe next time my insomina sets in or perhaps I'll just fly to and from Europe (a lot) :-(

Doc_N

Any wrote: »

Really? Well, I cannot see any sense in the comparison.. Given that Coop PROMISES for the price of the funeral not to change (apart from fees as you pointed out), which Airmiles NEVER did.

There's every point to the comparison - it's a very similar situation. Both companies have had the money up-front. Both provide a service for that money at some undetermined time in the future. But one fixes the price (funeral plans) and one doesn't (Airmiles).

I've never suggested that Airmiles can't make the changes they're making - of course they can. Their T&C allow them to. That doesn't make it right, though, or necessary, or fair to their customers, and it's just an excuse to increase their profits at their customers' expense.

By the way, the Co-op plan does include fees - even the ones paid to third parties that are outside their control:

• Sound financial sense – with a Funeral Plan the cost is fixed at today's prices, so you don't pay any more regardless of how prices rise.
• Guaranteed – all the services in our Funeral Plans are fully covered so there is no more to pay for them; even the fees paid to third parties such as the crematorium authority or the minister are included.

loates123

If anyone from air miles is looking can you give me some advice . I have 22000 miles to use and was hoping to use for florida or cuba next school summer holidays .at the moment there is not one available flight unless I go to florida for 3days in august which I cant see the point off.i have spoken on the phone again to air miles and no one seems to have any knowledge if any dates will become available. So my question is should I wait for flights to get released .there is a available flight from manchester to florida in may . I dont want to really go then but if the dates for july august summer holidays dont get released and then the may date is then sold I am not going to be able to use my miles at all till 2013 as cant travel any other time and that will mean pay taxes for long haul flights :-(

Any

Doc_N wrote: »

There's every point to the comparison - it's a very similar situation. Both companies have had the money up-front. Both provide a service for that money at some undetermined time in the future. But one fixes the price (funeral plans) and one doesn't (Airmiles).

I've never suggested that Airmiles can't make the changes they're making - of course they can. Their T&C allow them to. That doesn't make it right, though, or necessary, or fair to their customers, and it's just an excuse to increase their profits at their customers' expense.

By the way, the Co-op plan does include fees - even the ones paid to third parties that are outside their control:

• Sound financial sense – with a Funeral Plan the cost is fixed at today's prices, so you don't pay any more regardless of how prices rise.
• Guaranteed – all the services in our Funeral Plans are fully covered so there is no more to pay for them; even the fees paid to third parties such as the crematorium authority or the minister are included.

Errr....
1/ In which case all vouchers/loyalty schemes etc should immediately cancel expiration dates and hold prices on... I don't think so.

2/ We will just have to agree to disagree that Coop funeral plan (insurance kind of thing) is the same as some loyalty scheme then :rotfl:No matter what the contract says.

3/ Malkie found the Coop clause about fees somewhere... Might be worth checking what is actually true if you are planning to buy one

This argument is getting IMO ridiculous. I have explained myself what my trace of thought is, and it is nothing else than that, my thought, that is the most I could do. There is no point of continuing with this.
And if you cannot see how the increase in fuel, extra surcharges and increase in fees is not affecting company like Airmiles then this is completely pointless.

Spyder15

Looking at all possibilities (once I could finally log onto the site), it looks like I may have been a tad fool hardy to even bother spending all my Shell points/Tesco vouchers/LloydsTSB airmiles and converting them into Airmiles.
From my local airport I can only fly to Belfast, Exeter, Gatwick, Jersey, Southampton, Hannover, Limoges or Stavanger. Now no disrespect to any of those destinations but I didn't really fancy a holiday to any of those places - was really looking at the Southern Hemisphere.
From reading all the posts in this thread (and there are lots) I think I may be better off either using my Airmiles for something else or using them to possibly upgrade if I pay cash for a long haul flight (if that is possible).
All very disheartening methinks. And if anyone wonders why I seem to have bothered saving all the vouchers and things I could have used elsewhere over the years its because Airmiles felt like a little savings scheme - you know putting a bit aside that I wouldn't miss to be used for something special later on.
So I was trying to frantically book something longhaul before the web deadline but I may as well leave it, allow them to be converted and use them for other "rewards" at some point in time.
If anyone has any better ideas though please feel free to comment.
:cool:

Any

Spyder15 wrote: »

Looking at all possibilities (once I could finally log onto the site), it looks like I may have been a tad fool hardy to even bother spending all my Shell points/Tesco vouchers/LloydsTSB airmiles and converting them into Airmiles.
From my local airport I can only fly to Belfast, Exeter, Gatwick, Jersey, Southampton, Hannover, Limoges or Stavanger. Now no disrespect to any of those destinations but I didn't really fancy a holiday to any of those places - was really looking at the Southern Hemisphere.
From reading all the posts in this thread (and there are lots) I think I may be better off either using my Airmiles for something else or using them to possibly upgrade if I pay cash for a long haul flight (if that is possible).
All very disheartening methinks. And if anyone wonders why I seem to have bothered saving all the vouchers and things I could have used elsewhere over the years its because Airmiles felt like a little savings scheme - you know putting a bit aside that I wouldn't miss to be used for something special later on.
So I was trying to frantically book something longhaul before the web deadline but I may as well leave it, allow them to be converted and use them for other "rewards" at some point in time.
If anyone has any better ideas though please feel free to comment.
:cool:

Well, I don't know why would someone think it is a little saving scheme if they actually read the T&C.. But that is just me.

Also Tesco offer so many different rewards, that I generally firstly check which one is the best value for me. Airmiles weren't that great for me for flights until now, so I collected few and chose different credit card etc, but now they are so I am converting to get more.

Another things they offer and I was using them for were things like package holidays on offer and hotels for weekend trips..
Also the fllight destinations change... as the destinations the companies offer change. Though I have to say there are some very weird destinations on your list if these are the only ones.. where is that from then? And surely the offer must have been the same before??

Doc_N

Any wrote: »

Errr....
1/ In which case all vouchers/loyalty schemes etc should immediately cancel expiration dates and hold prices on... I don't think so.

2/ We will just have to agree to disagree that Coop funeral plan (insurance kind of thing) is the same as some loyalty scheme then :rotfl:No matter what the contract says.

3/ Malkie found the Coop clause about fees somewhere... Might be worth checking what is actually true if you are planning to buy one

This argument is getting IMO ridiculous. I have explained myself what my trace of thought is, and it is nothing else than that, my thought, that is the most I could do. There is no point of continuing with this.
And if you cannot see how the increase in fuel, extra surcharges and increase in fees is not affecting company like Airmiles then this is completely pointless.

Let's just agree to differ then, shall we?

I've explained what the Co-op can and does do (and the confirmation that external fees are included is taken straight from their website) and the increases in costs they have to cope with are every bit as great as those that Airmiles have to cope with.

The Co-op don't increase their charges. Airmiles do. If you don't understand that the reason for that is just a cynical move to increase their profits, I can't help that.

They'll get away with it, because their T&C entitle them to do it, but it does surprise me that so few people realise that it isn't actually necessary in economic terms - it's just a nice little profit booster for them.