Check your driving licence discussion 26 July 2011 at 1:11PM edited 22 August 2017 at 12:32PM in Motoring 297 replies 82.2K views

Paradigm

trousersnake01 wrote: »

Your licence is valid until a day before you are 70 only if your photocard is valid.

If you allow your photocard to expire then this makes your licence invalid.

When the first issue of photocard style licences started to expire, your DVLA driver record would be marked up as 'expired substantive or provisional depending on what you had.
Police were instructed to allow one year after the expiry of the photocard before dealing with this.

That changed I believe last summer.

You now have only up to one month to exchange your photocard licence once it has expired.

If you go over the month your driver record changes from 'expired' to 'revoked'.

That means you no longer have a driving licence, the privilege to drive by the DVLA has been withdrawn.

You can, of course, point us to this new legislation? Links to or verifiable quotes from the DVLA?

Photocard driving licences are only valid for up to 10 years. The expiry of the photo on a drivers’ licence does not affect the validity period of the entitlement shown on the licence.

If this has now changed a link would be nice

YORKSHIRELASS

I have just renewed my photocard licence. It says in the documents that I received that I can continue driving until the new licence arrives. It doesnt say anywhere that there is a time limit and what this time limit is. Looking online I cant see anywhere where it states that my licence will be revoked within a month if I dont renew it.

If this is the case then it needs to be made clearer!

Paradigm

YORKSHIRELASS wrote: »

I have just renewed my photocard licence. It says in the documents that I received that I can continue driving until the new licence arrives. It doesnt say anywhere that there is a time limit and what this time limit is. Looking online I cant see anywhere where it states that my licence will be revoked within a month if I dont renew it.

If this is the case then it needs to be made clearer!

You won't find it for a good reason......

sarahg1969

trousersnake01 wrote: »

Talking about the photocard and counterpart style licences.

Your licence is valid until a day before you are 70 only if your photocard is valid.

If you allow your photocard to expire then this makes your licence invalid.

When the first issue of photocard style licences started to expire, your DVLA driver record would be marked up as 'expired substantive or provisional depending on what you had.
Police were instructed to allow one year after the expiry of the photocard before dealing with this.

That changed I believe last summer.

You now have only up to one month to exchange your photocard licence once it has expired.

If you go over the month your driver record changes from 'expired' to 'revoked'.

That means you no longer have a driving licence, the privilege to drive by the DVLA has been withdrawn.

So grasp that thought, you are now driving without a licence.
Minimum 3 points £60 fine, tell your insurance company that you have three points for driving without a licence and expect a hike in your annual charge for 5 years.
The points stay on your licence for 4 years and valid for 3.

Further still , because you are now driving without a licence your car will be siezed and taken to a pound which costs £150 to get back and £20 a night after the first night.

And if you can't get your pride and joy back within 7 days because you havent got a licence it will become a cube of scrap.

So I think £2 a year is well worth having a valid ID for.

They are in existence to protect you the road user from unlicenced drivers.

Recent statistics showed that one in twelve drivers stopped by the police didnt have a valid licence, ie none at all, a provisional, foreigh non EU.

So thats a lot of unqualified drivers out there driving alongside you.
And it also showed that one in eight holds no insurance.

So trust me on this, one month over your expiry date and you haven't got a licence. All it needs is for you to contact DVLA with new pictures.

Also if the DVLA write to you and you ignore their letter they will stop your licence. Just because you physically hold that bit of card, doesn't mean its valid.

Well, that's odd. I've had my documents checked by the police twice since my photo expired, and they were satisfied that my licence was valid.

You are talking absolute rubbish.Unless you can point us in the direction of some evidence to back you up?

Aretnap

trousersnake01 wrote: »

Your licence is valid until a day before you are 70 only if your photocard is valid.

Well, that's odd because Section 99 of the Road Traffic Act seems quite clear on the subject to me.

Duration of licences.
(1)In so far as a licence authorises its holder to drive motor vehicles of classes other than any prescribed class of goods vehicle or any prescribed class of passenger-carrying vehicle, it shall, unless previously revoked or surrendered, remain in force, subject to subsection (2) below—
(a)except in a case falling within paragraph (b) or (c) of this subsection, for the period ending on the seventieth anniversary of the applicant’s date of birth or for a period of three years, whichever is the longer,
(b)except in a case falling within paragraph (c) of this subsection, if the Secretary of State so determines in the case of a licence to be granted to a person appearing to him to be suffering from a relevant or prospective disability, for such period of not more than three years and not less than one year as the Secretary of State may determine, and
(c)in the case of a licence granted in exchange for a subsisting licence and in pursuance of an application requesting a licence for the period authorised by this paragraph, for a period equal to the remainder of that for which the subsisting licence was granted,
and any such period shall begin with the date on which the licence in question is expressed to come into force.

So it remains in force until your 70th birthday, or until revoked or surrendered, unless you get a shorter duration one for medical reasons, or unless subsection 2 (which deals with provisional motorbike licences) applies. Nothing there about the photocard having to be valid.

Moving on, it says

(2A)Where, in accordance with the preceding provisions of this section, a licence in the form of a photocard remains in force for a period of more than ten years, the holder of the licence must surrender it and its counterpart to the Secretary of State not later than the end of the period of ten years beginning with—
(a)the date shown on the licence as the date of its issue, or
(b)if the licence was granted by way of renewal or replacement of a licence bearing the same photograph, the date shown on the earliest licence bearing that photograph as the date of issue of that licence.

So you must surrender your photocard after 10 years. But it remains in force until you actually do surrender it, it is revoked, or until you are 70.

(4)Where the name or address of the licence holder as specified in a licence ceases to be correct, its holder must forthwith surrender the licence and its counterpart to the Secretary of State

So you also have to surrender your licence (note the use of the same word) if your name or address change.

(5)A person who without reasonable cause fails to comply with the duty under subsection (2A),(3) or(4) above is guilty of an offence.

So renewing your photocard is the same as updating your licence on changing your address. You commit an offence by not doing so, but you don't commit a further offence by driving having failed to do so.

If you're suggesting that the DVLA revoke licences where the photocard has not been updated, perhaps you could point to the legislation which allows them to do this? Because I can't seem to find it. Subsection 3 of RTA99 allows them to do so in certain circumstances, but none of them have anything to do with expired photos.

trousersnake01 wrote: »

So grasp that thought, you are now driving without a licence. Minimum 3 points £60 fine, tell your insurance company that you have three points for driving without a licence and expect a hike in your annual charge for 5 years.
The points stay on your licence for 4 years and valid for 3.

Erm, nope. Even allowing that you do commit the offence of driving otherwise than in accordance with a licence, which I'm far from convinced that you do, have a look at the statutory penalties. Endorsement only applies "in a case where the offender’s driving would not have been in accordance with any licence that could have been granted to him" - eg where he's never passed a test, or he's unable to hold a licence for medical reasons. Where he's entitled to hold a licence but hasn't done the correct paperwork the offence is non-endorsable.

They are in existence to protect you the road user from unlicenced drivers.

Recent statistics showed that one in twelve drivers stopped by the police didnt have a valid licence, ie none at all, a provisional, foreigh non EU.

So thats a lot of unqualified drivers out there driving alongside you.
And it also showed that one in eight holds no insurance.

I'm struggling to understand what expired photocards have to do with uninsured or unqualified drivers, or provisional, foreign, non-EU drivers.

Aretnap

lifecatalyst wrote: »

Can anyone tell me if you still have to renew if you don't drive anymore.

My son got his renewal form through & has ignored it for a few months so his photo has now expired. He doesn't have a motorbike anymore & has no plans to drive in the near future. Will he get fined if he doesn't renew?

See my post above: he's obliged to surrender the licence whether he drives or not. He commits an offence if he doesn't do so, though not, it seems, an offence which people are often, if ever, prosecuted for. If he wants to comply with the law but keep his £20 for now he can always surrender the licence and not renew it, but then he won't have a licence and will have to apply for a new one if he intends to start driving again (I don't think he'd have to take his test again, but he might have to pay more than £20 - not sure on that point).

[Deleted User]

Aretnap wrote: »

but then he won't have a licence and will have to apply for a new one if he intends to start driving again (I don't think he'd have to take his test again

I think that would depend on how much time passes between him surrendering his licence, and applying for a new one.

DVLA don't keep records indefinitely, as some people who had motorcycle entitlement removed at renewal, found out to their cost.

wealdroam

Anyone noticed that trousersnake01 claims to be a "traffic cop" on his user profile?

There is even a picture of him sitting astride a Metropolitan Police motorcycle on his "homepage" linked from his profile.

So those who doubt what he said, must be mistaken, eh?

[Deleted User]

wealdroam wrote: »

So those who doubt what he said, must be mistaken, eh?

I don't know about that.

I was once told, by an Traffic Inspector of all people, that you have to answer the questions at a traffic census. :laugh:

Garret123

Knowing what is on your driving record and how to check your driving record online can be important to your livelihood and personal well-being. Knowing if you have a suspended license could mean the difference between getting hauled off to jail as opposed to addressing the suspension and making the necessary arrangements through the proper channels....