You can refuse the Work Programme

DebiT

excalibar wrote: »

If it's illegal then you can't get sancationed then? if one does not want to participate in this work programme (Maximus) then what do they have to do? send letters to whome and which letters???..


So you can just turn up at you're own hours? what if you cannot come in the mornings but evenings, can they allow this?

What if one does not need much help, do they only get to come once every week? and if one has to do some modules is it possible they can be done at late afternoons? do they have different classes in a day? for example a morning class, an afternoon class & an evening class but the classes are all the same in terms of modules and everything..Also it true you the time and day you have to come in reflect your surname? meaning if someone has a name/surname beginning with A they have to come in the mornings?

sorry for the repative questions I just want to have an idea of how it's going to be like is all as I have not found too many people who have done this programme or started it.

Thanks!

If you visit this site www.workprogramme.org.uk it will tell you what letters to send, who to send them to and when. You will also be able to read other people's experiences of the work programme and how they avoided it.

LadyMissA

WPN wrote: »

You can refuse it because its illegal. You can be sanctioned for anything at all including this - you are supposed to comply not dispute any schemes.

maximus is just one of the organisations delivering the scheme... they all are pretty much the same however.

*speculation*

Many jobs are given through the backdoor... i.e. providers have deals with employers, where certain jobs wont be advertised elsewhere but only through providers.

Most will be at a specific time rather than just turning up (jobsearch might be an exception to this). Most people (depending on provider and area etc.) will only have to meet once every week or two initially. Some people have been on "modules" which required extra attendance.

Longer term there will be fulltime workfare... this might be at 6 months or 18 months... everything is discretion based, so provider staff can choose what happens to whom... all at the penalty of benefit sanctions.

The scheme is an illegal workfare scheme without training, so at some point if you haven't got a job you will be working just for JSA. It is not about having a "job" but a job that pays... minimum wage or higher! Furthermore, in 2012 sanctions will start from 3 months, go to 6 month for second offence, and then to 3 years for a third offence. Being late, not attending (perhaps provider didn't tell you), being kicked off the scheme etc. all can get you a sanction. This is on top of sanctions for not applying for jobs - which you might not have been told about. If you refuse now, you could lose 2 weeks money (if first offence in a year) but it might be better than longterm.

You are saying people on the work programme have to do work for the jsa?

That's not what my provider have told me. They told me I am 'work ready' and they wont need to see me hardly and probably only once a month with whatever task they set me to do etc.

They said my situtation is a bit different to others they have already seen. I guess as I have 20+ years experience in my profession.

donnajunkie

excalibar wrote: »

If it's illegal then you can't get sancationed then? if one does not want to participate in this work programme (Maximus) then what do they have to do? send letters to whome and which letters???..


So you can just turn up at you're own hours? what if you cannot come in the mornings but evenings, can they allow this?

What if one does not need much help, do they only get to come once every week? and if one has to do some modules is it possible they can be done at late afternoons? do they have different classes in a day? for example a morning class, an afternoon class & an evening class but the classes are all the same in terms of modules and everything..Also it true you the time and day you have to come in reflect your surname? meaning if someone has a name/surname beginning with A they have to come in the mornings?

sorry for the repative questions I just want to have an idea of how it's going to be like is all as I have not found too many people who have done this programme or started it.

Thanks!

you will have an appointment with an adviser then 2 weeks later they will phone you at home and then 2 weeks after that you will see your adviser and so on. any kind of training sessions they want you to do you will have to do them and that will be whenever they are scheduled. i have been told i can go in to do jobsearch anytime between 3pm and 5pm. although they didnt say if it was required immediately or what the minimum number of days per week they require of me, or the minimum amount of applications they require of me. i plan to go in this tuesday and hopefully get the answers to these questions.

donnajunkie

LadyMissA wrote: »

You are saying people on the work programme have to do work for the jsa?

That's not what my provider have told me. They told me I am 'work ready' and they wont need to see me hardly and probably only once a month with whatever task they set me to do etc.

They said my situtation is a bit different to others they have already seen. I guess as I have 20+ years experience in my profession.

if you dont get a job fairly quickly i suspect they will start talking about sending you on a placement. even if they find you a job you may find the employer wants you to do a work trial.

kt33uk

ok have sat and read through this thread and still can't make head or tail of why it is illegal.

I was reffered (forced, pushed, whatever you want to call it) to the Work Program just over a month ago. My provider is sited in the middle of an industrial estate or rather in the middle of a busy working factory area. First meeting I went to was a group one and to say it was a shamble would be an understatement. One of the people definently didn't want to be there and was pretty vocal about it. What I did pick up from the meeting was that there were there to help me find a job! they had access to jobs that were not advertised and the icing on the cake there was no funds whatsover for training available. Any training would have to be funded through application to ILA Scotland who offer £200 towards training.

The thing is most of the people that I have met who have been referred there are people like myself, people who have been not worked for at least 10 years. One man I met was 58 years old and he definently didn't look in the best of health. He had walked the half mile from the road to get to the place and looked like he was going to pass out. I have to attend WP once a week for 1 hour to job search, then once a month (i think) I have to go see an adviser. Not once have I been asked for any information that I would deem to personal to give out. Never been asked for my bank details and why they would need to know them anyway is beyond me - they pay my travel expense by cash - so I would never dream of giving them my bank details.

What I do not like about this program is that fact that I am stuck with them for 2 years even if I find a job. So if I was to find and start a job next month (wishful thinking) I would still be stuck with this lot contacting me for the next 22 months to see how I am getting on. I asked why I would want to maintain contact with them if I had found a job and was told that this was the problem with previous programs, people were helped to find employment and no follow-up was ever done as to whether people were coping or not. According to them many people ended up back signing on.

Funny thing is that the company who are providing the WP in my area are the same company who have provided all the previous programs that didn't work.

LadyMissA

kt33uk wrote: »

What I do not like about this program is that fact that I am stuck with them for 2 years even if I find a job. So if I was to find and start a job next month (wishful thinking) I would still be stuck with this lot contacting me for the next 22 months to see how I am getting on. I asked why I would want to maintain contact with them if I had found a job and was told that this was the problem with previous programs, people were helped to find employment and no follow-up was ever done as to whether people were coping or not. According to them many people ended up back signing on.

Funny thing is that the company who are providing the WP in my area are the same company who have provided all the previous programs that didn't work.

To see if they are coping? With what? Work?

donnajunkie

LadyMissA wrote: »

To see if they are coping? With what? Work?

its to make sure their bonus is safe and to gather evidence against you should you lose the job so that they can sanction you when you get sent back.

LadyMissA

donnajunkie wrote: »

its to make sure their bonus is safe and to gather evidence against you should you lose the job so that they can sanction you when you get sent back.

stop saying you will lose your job

WPN

LadyMissA wrote: »

You are saying people on the work programme have to do work for the jsa?

That's not what my provider have told me. They told me I am 'work ready' and they wont need to see me hardly and probably only once a month with whatever task they set me to do etc.

They said my situtation is a bit different to others they have already seen. I guess as I have 20+ years experience in my profession.

If the scheme was proper, it would be under Section 17A of Jobseekers Act 1995.

Jobcentre Plus believes the scheme is genuine under the above section.

The above section, is "work for your benefit" (workfare) schemes without mention of training! (Some "training" could be offered if the provider feels that it will secure you the job so they can get an outcome)

Everything is by discretion so you might not have to do any work... but "work ready" now... if you are unemployed in say 3-6 months time, this could all change.

WPN

donnajunkie wrote: »

if you dont get a job fairly quickly i suspect they will start talking about sending you on a placement. even if they find you a job you may find the employer wants you to do a work trial.

It wouldnt surprise me if the providers didn't try claiming from the work trial period to get sustainable payments!!