You can refuse the Work Programme

Mayflip

WPN wrote: »

Interesting points regarding "data controller" although DWP do not have lawful authority to contact employers and force them to produce information on a person unless for the purpose of suspected fraud. It is a crime for an Employment Officer to disclose information without lawful authority. They have many powers from so many laws, however, they do not get the ultimate choice of sending anyones personal information to whoever they like. This isn't a dispute between jobseekers of whom are all alleged scroungers and taxpayers who are hard workers, allegedly. Its the same with HMRC and other Government departments. They have a duty on the information they hold.

I wasn't saying that DWP could force employers to divulge any information - which they cannot. Employers can, if they wish, not provide any information at all.

LadyMissA

donnajunkie wrote: »

why do you? what if you say i want to sign off and dont want to tell you why? can they really stop a person from signing off if they want to just because they dont say why? i know if i won the lottery i would not want to tell them that was why i was signing off.

ok you are right , just looked at the ES40JP booklet and it says you can fill in parts 1-4 but you fo not have to all you have to do is sign for the last day you wish to claim for.

But having said that when you start a job you get £100 paid to you so if you do not tell them you have a job you will not get this £100 and here too in Essex where we are on the C2C train line they have a deal with C2C that if you get a job you get two months travel on that line from where you live to any point on the line for £10 and to give you that ticket the job centre need to see proof you have a job and they need the offer letter and confirmation of your start date so in that instance I would have to tell them or I need to find £150 to get to work!

popadom

LadyMissA wrote: »

you have to on the booklet you sign and hand in when you sign off.

I just call them up. If they ask who offered me the job i have said "cant remember".If it is for statisitcs, they dont really need to know which company

donnajunkie wrote: »

perhaps that is the case. i wonder why they are so keen to repeatedly tell people to let them know if they get a job.

statistics? they can then tell everyone there getting x amount of people in work each week.

popadom

Bionik_Bonce wrote: »

Re: signing off without a reason or just not telling the JCP.

this is possible however it can affect you receiving benefits that you should be entitled too such as the job start grant and the 4 week housing benefit and council tax run on. fail to sign off correctly and neither of these benefits will be paid. the criteria for these are having an unbroken claim for 26 weeks and be starting a job that is expected to last more than 5 weeks.

.

When i have told them before(and given the compnay) i havnt got the extra run on of four weeks,. The jobcentre tell housing im not getting jsa, then i get a letter stating"you are no longer entitled" , nothing about an extra 4 weeks. I have had the grant, once.

donnajunkie

Bionik_Bonce wrote: »

I disagree, I have seen many people go into placements where a job was not on the cards. I have also seen those people do so well that a job has been created for them.

well then they werent sent somewhere were there was no chance of a job.

donnajunkie

Bionik_Bonce wrote: »

also what if the only thing stopping someone getting a job is lack of a reference? or that they want to try something new but no one will give them a chance? placements give people the opportunity to do this without signing off benefit for a short term contract. there are many positives to work placements and as stated many people who come into WP may not have worked, at all, in decades or may not think they can work. work placements have many benefits and tarring them all as "providing free labour for employers" is not only misguided it is dangerous as the people that DO need that experience/reference/chance, hear that negativity and it will come across in their placement.

as I have stated before. providers gain no benefit to providing work placements for employers. none. employers receive no incentive to take people and many won't consider it as it costs them money. it is only the people on the work placements who can stand to benefit.

yes people can sometimes get something from a placement but it is still providing free labour and it is debatable how much use a reference from a placement is if you were not there on merit.
providers may not gain but they are required as part of their contract to send people on placement and if there is knowhere available were there is a chance of a job then they just send people anywhere. a provider around here sent people to a training centre due to the lack of decent placements.
also around here many employers jump at the chance of getting people for free, the local council, tescos, poundland are just a few of them. i had an interview for a placement once and at the beginning they said they were desperate for someone because they had just one bloke in the workshop working by himself. a bit later after they had been told they could have me for 18 weeks they said we cant be sure of being able to offer him employment after 18 weeks. so on the way back i told the placement officer i didnt want to do it as they were clearly taking the p***.

donnajunkie

popadom wrote: »

When i have told them before(and given the compnay) i havnt got the extra run on of four weeks,. The jobcentre tell housing im not getting jsa, then i get a letter stating"you are no longer entitled" , nothing about an extra 4 weeks. I have had the grant, once.

you have to be named on the tenancy to get it. if you are and dont get it i would enquire why.

LadyMissA

popadom wrote: »

I just call them up. If they ask who offered me the job i have said "cant remember".If it is for statisitcs, they dont really need to know which company


statistics? they can then tell everyone there getting x amount of people in work each week.

how do you get your £100 then as thats only paid to you when you get a job?

Bionik_Bonce

popadom wrote: »

When I have told them before (and given the company) I haven’tot the extra run on of four weeks, The jobcentre tell housing im not getting jsa, then i get a letter stating"you are no longer entitled" , nothing about an extra 4 weeks. I have had the grant, once.

the only reason you would not get this is if A) you do not meet the qualifying criteria or you have signed off incorrectly.

Qualifying criteria are

having an unbroken claim, and be receiving benefit for 26 consecutive weeks prior to fining the job.

Be starting work that is expected to last more than 5 weeks.

If you meet these criteria but aren’t getting it something is wrong and I would ask your JCP advisor why you aren’t receiving it.

well then they werent sent somewhere were there was no chance of a job.

the specific example (though there are many) that jumps to mind is a chap who was told day one "I will not employ you, there is no job here. I cannot afford to take anyone on and I will not be taking on anytime in the near future." within 4 weeks the chap had worked so hard and so well that the boss decided he wanted him and created a job for him.

providers may not gain but they are required as part of their contract to send people on placement

not under WP.

also around here many employers jump at the chance of getting people for free, the local council, tescos, poundland are just a few of them. I had an interview for a placement once and at the beginning they said they were desperate for someone because they had just one bloke in the workshop working by himself. A bit later after they had been told they could have me for 18 weeks they said we can’t be sure of being able to offer him employment after 18 weeks. so on the way back I told the placement officer I didn’t want to do it as they were clearly taking the p***

unfortunately this does happen and to say that it doesn't is simple lunacy. Like any system work placements can be abused by JSA claimant and by JCP and y employer, however not all placements end this way and that’s the point I wanted to make.

WPN

Bionik_Bonce thanks for clearing that up.