Stand and Deliver. £30 or your

kev1n3

magyar wrote:

If the offence is driving without due care and attention, then they wouldn't have a hope. DwDCaA is a "careless driving" offence which is committed "when the accused's driving falls below the standard expected of a reasonable, prudent and competent driver in all the circumstances of the case."

From the CPS web site:
The following are examples of driving which may amount to driving without due care and attention:
overtaking on the inside;
driving inappropriately close to another vehicle;
driving through a red light;
emerging from a side road into the path of another vehicle;
Conduct whilst driving, such as:
using a hand held mobile telephone while the vehicle is moving;
tuning a car radio;
reading a newspaper/map;
selecting and lighting a cigarette/cigar/pipe;
talking to and looking at a passenger;

Clearly you didn't do any of these whilst driving.

Thankyou.. this is my starting point.

Ivrytwr3

The driving without due care is for mobile phone use/eating etc whilst driving

The offence is:

"not being in proper control of a vehicle on the public highway”

Why don't you drop a line to the Force Chief Constable, he probably won't do anything, but behind closed doors the police in question might get the awkward question of what the !!!! are they playing at?

Or you could drop the tabloids a line, they love stuff like this, especiall more so as it is meant to be the season of goodwill etc.

Or just fight it in court.

magyar

Ivrytwr3 wrote:

The driving without due care is for mobile phone use/eating etc whilst driving

The offence is:

"not being in proper control of a vehicle on the public highway”

Why don't you drop a line to the Force Chief Constable, he probably won't do anything, but behind closed doors the police in question might get the awkward question of what the !!!! are they playing at?

Or you could drop the tabloids a line, they love stuff like this, especiall more so as it is meant to be the season of goodwill etc.

Or just fight it in court.

Surely the highlighted words are the pertinent ones. If the handbrake was on and the gearstick was in neutral then the car is being "properly controlled".

Agree with the actions above: I'd love to see this taken to court - although I very much doubt the CPS would allow it.

You can see why people doubt the veracity of this; even the most junior of officers should realise that there is no chance of getting this to stick.

magyar

Seems like others have been similarly treated

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,588-974654_3,00.html

kev1n3

a quote from the link " Drivers have also been fined for eating a Kit Kat and a banana, and even taking a sip from a bottle of mineral water"

while in motion i presume? or "behind the wheel" as i was?

Ivrytwr3

Driving without due care and attention and not being in proper control of a vehicle on the public highway are two seperate offences. Forget about Driving without due care and attention as you have correctly identified that you were not driving.

That leaves you with not being in proper control of a vehicle on the public highway. Which does not need you to be driving.

Hot_Fuzz

Kev, in the twenty years i've done this job i've never had to attend court for an Fixed Penalty Notice (FPN). I would be really surprised if they would ask the reporting officer let alone the other one to attend.Many people do attend the court in person and tickets do get cancelled but it's dealt with at Mags court, so no jury etc. It will depend on who is on the bench that day and what sort of mood there in. the only down side is if they do find you guilty of the offence they could try to get a costs order, the fine itself won't go up.

I mentioned it at work today and most (A) couldn't beleive that you got a ticket and (B) said they would fight it.

Someone also said if you didn't like the officers actions then go to the Independant Police Complaints Commission, having been on the receiving end(i was innocent, honest) it was not a nice experince. I have no idea if this costs or not.

Let us know.

magyar

Ivrytwr3 wrote:

Driving without due care and attention and not being in proper control of a vehicle on the public highway are two seperate offences. Forget about Driving without due care and attention as you have correctly identified that you were not driving.

That leaves you with not being in proper control of a vehicle on the public highway. Which does not need you to be driving.

But does require a material breach of the law. Clearly there are instances where a car can be stationary but you are not in control e.g. if you walk off and leave the engine running, but in this instance there was no loss of control by comparison to someone who isn't drinking milk. I mean, technically you could argue that people are committing offences every time they put the handbrake on at traffic lights. With the handbrake on, your car is 'out of control' and more likely to skid - or at least would be if you were moving. But you're not moving, so it's fine.

Out of interest, Kevin, you have to be told what offence you're alleged to have commited - does this not say so on the FPN?

kev1n3

Sorry guys, maybe I didn’t explain properly. The cop didn’t give me a FPN, Just as he was about to start writing the penalty I told him to “Stuff his ticket because I intend to plead not guilty at court”. (More of a bluff than anything) he then said "that’s ok, there are two of us and only one of you, who are the courts going to believe"?

He didn’t caution me or inform me that he was going to report me, or for what offence. However he did stress (when I pointed out that I was not driving) that drinking milk or any other liquid while in control of a vehicle is as bad as using a mobile phone while driving. I made great effort not to reply to his remark because by now my temperature is beginning to rise and didn’t want the situation to deteriate and find myself locked up in a cell for a few hours. .

How many people pull over to the side of the road to answer there mobile while the engine is running? I do it all the time.

This exercise by the police has had a very negative affect on at least one level headed, law abiding citizen of this country. I will never want to, or will help the police with any intelligence gathering exercises (as so often happens when they come knocking on your door to ask about such and such that happened up the road a few days ago etc.) that would help them solve crime with exception to crimes against children or pensioners.

It is fast becoming a ‘look after your self ’ Society, The more I talk to people about the pettiness I have experienced from the police recently, the more horror stories of police failure I hear in return.

It has completely changed my views on there integrity, morality, and sense of decency of some of the police in the service today. I’m fully aware that not ALL coppers act with such terribly low self-steam and disregard for law abiding people.
I am sure the majority of coppers do the job with a sense of pride and responsibility.

I, and many millions of other decent law abiding people contribute to the economical growth of this country by paying there taxes etc, and go about there business in an orderly responsible fashion every day. We deserve respect.

Like many others on here, who have read this thread ,the time of year being a season of good makes this even harder to believe that a cop would want to act in this manner.

That cop knows deep down inside he was wrong. He was in his early 40s (40 - 43ish) so he was obviously a mature thinking guy and not some young jobs-worth straight out of police academy. If he, and cops like him continue to police in this fashion, they will only distance the police further from the public
As promised.. As soon as I receive the summons I will scan, edit my personal details, and post on here.


Kev

update.

I asked the copper if he was traffic police, he said NO. I have absolutly no idea why i asked him that question. I just did.

Thanks for the The IPCC's info compsing an email tomorrow.

SaraSeahorse

I find the layby confusing too as on one occasion I was told a layby was not public highway

we had problem locally with a car left on jack with no wheel in layby outside school - in fact I believe it is still there 2 months on.

Several people reported the vehicle as they felt it was unsafe and felt this had gone beyong 'temporary' repair.

I spoke face to face to local police officer and was told that owner had been asked politely to move vehicle. I asked why the vehicle was allowed to be left like this unsafe and unroadworthy but was told it was a layby and not public highway!