Teachers please - Y4 expected SATS levels

Spendless

He fetched to my attention earlier this year that hewasn't holding his pen correctly Gingham, and he was holding it towards the bottom so it wasn't noticeable, that he wasn't holding it correctly.(iyswim)

I searched my town for a 'special pen' that my daughter had said Infant school had once given her, to no avail. Then I mentioned it to his teacher at parents evening, and told her the problems I'd had sourcing a pen, and offerred to pay if she could find me one. His teacher was shocked she hadn't noticed, said she'd watch for it the following day, which she did and went to the schools inclusion manager who provided him with a couple of triangle shaped pens and pencils. I don't know if that would be the whole of his problem? :cool:

t4mof

Gingham_R wrote: »

I really feel for you.

Teachers are not trained in this and my only training in high ability was a casual comment that bright kids could effectively 'fend for themselves' in the classroom. So I don't blame teachers who don't get it. It's not their fault. But it's VERY damaging to children when their needs aren't being met - regardless of whether their learning difference is seen as a 'disability' or a 'gift'.

I don't blame the teachers - I qualified myself back in 1998 (I don't teach now though) and I don't remember having any formal training in G&T children. Teachers are generally left to differentiate their work but it's hard when they have a child who is working above the level of the top group. You can't have that one child sat on their own each lesson.

It's the system that's wrong:

peachyprice wrote: »

This only goes to prove the real purpose of the y6 SATS. They are not for the benefit of the child at all, they are for the benefit of the school.

peachyprice wrote: »

Have you spoken to the high school he's going to to see if they do their own assessments within the first few weeks of joining?

We will but we're not at that stage yet. He will go into Y6 in September but I'm not having Y7 wasted like Y3 was. His new Y6 teacher seems quite switched on so we will broach the subject at the parents evening in October.

jellyhead wrote: »

What do they do for bright kids in year 6?

For my DS it's just a case of having his work differentiated TBH. I just have to rely on his teacher being able to push him.

They got him involved with an extended writing after school group which re-wrote the school prospectus and his Y5 teacher said she tried to encourage him to go to lunch time maths club but he's 10 and wants to be out playing footy rather than spending his lunch time doing maths!

jellyhead wrote: »

It's a shame all schools don't have a budget for gifted children, because being gifted is a SEN too.

They do/should have a budget. I believe all schools have to identify their G&T children and put them on a register... and that's it as far as I can tell. They don't have to use the budget they've been given or demonstrate the value added progress that they've made with their G&T children just so long as they've identified them!

Another long post, sorry. There was just a lot I wanted to comment on

jellyhead

Off topic but do high schools have to demonstrate value added? (it just means they are progressing through the levels rather than sticking at the same one for years).

I had to show high school evidence that my son's year 9 literacy grade was lower than his year 6 grade, so not only had he made no progress in 3 years he had actually slipped. I know they are assessed differently in KS3, but even so ...

I heard a lot in primary about value added, but nothing in high school - it was as if I was the only person to notice.

peachyprice

t4mof wrote: »

We will but we're not at that stage yet. He will go into Y6 in September but I'm not having Y7 wasted like Y3 was. His new Y6 teacher seems quite switched on so we will broach the subject at the parents evening in October.

Sorry, I mis-understood, I thought he was going into year 7 in September.

You may have the chance to speak to someone when you go to the high school open evenings before you choose your high schools and before you start the school you get you should have an interview where you can raise any concerns you have.

HTH

JC9297

peachyprice wrote: »

This only goes to prove the real purpose of the y6 SATS. They are not for the benefit of the child at all, they are for the benefit of the school.

The school won't care that your child can gain a level 6 because they are only required to report the number of children that have achieved up to level 5. This is why they would rather spend the money getting the less-able children up to level 4, they do not want to have to report that children are leaving yr6 having only reached level 3, it does not good on their league tables.

Have you spoken to the high school he's going to to see if they do their own assessments within the first few weeks of joining?

But the point of SATs testing IS to test the schools not the children.

peachyprice

Erm, isn't that what I said?

The trouble is, schools do not make it apparent, they drum into the children and parents how important SAT's are, it's not until you've gone through school with your first child that you realise that's the case.

If the schools made it apparent it was for their benefit, not the child's we wouldn't have so many parent here stressing about grades and asking where you can get sample papers to improve their child's level.

JC9297

t4mof wrote: »

My concern is that he has a real chance of being a Level 6 yet this isn't going to get passed onto his secondary school and he'll be seen by the secondary school as one of the Level 5 children when he's working above that level. This year the school have achieved 34% of children gaining Level 5 in English and Maths so it's a reasonably high achieving school.

I believe secondary schools receive the actual marks of the SATs so they know which kids got full marks and which just scraped a 5. Also primary school teachers pass on detailed information about each child's ability. When my son started in year 7 they were setted for maths based on this information, and whilst there is some movement up and down generally they are pretty accurate.

Whilst your son may be ahead of his classmates now, there will be other children coming from other primary schools with similar, or even higher, abilities so the secondary school should be able to meet their needs appropriately.

JC9297

peachyprice wrote: »

Erm, isn't that what I said?

The trouble is, schools do not make it apparent, they drum into the children and parents how important SAT's are, it's not until you've gone through school with your first child that you realise that's the case.

If the schools made it apparent it was for their benefit, not the child's we wouldn't have so many parent here stressing about grades and asking where you can get sample papers to improve their child's level.

Sorry, I read your previous comment as if you were suggesting the schools had an ulterior motive in getting the kids to do well, without telling the parents.
I think many schools do make a point of saying " it's not you it's the school that's been tested", but in reality every parent wants their child to do as well as possible. Particularly in year6 when it can have a bearing on their start to secondary education.

thatgirlsam

Sorry to resurrect this old thread

Just wanted to say that my 12 year old dd has been assessed this week as a level 8c for Maths at her secondary school

I knew she was way ahead and her teacher in year 6 said she was working at a level 8 but not very many people beleived me when I said

For all those who have children that are ahead - don't listen to the doubters!!

liney

It is great that your daughter is doing so well, but remeber she has been at secondary school for 2 whole terms now, so she was probably a low/mid level 7 ie 7c/7b in Year 6, and has climbed through 7a to now 8c whilst at secondary school, Year 7.

In any case, very well done to her