Tyres - What is the Truth?

Wig

bigjl wrote: »

You don't have to explain why you chose to buy inferior tyres Wig.

That is your personal choice.

To argue that a cheap tyre is the same as a premium tyre in all aspects other than price is the only thing that nobody agrees with.

They are the same to me, everyday I experience nothing fom my tyres except what I expect from them. They support my car and help to iron out the bumps in the road, I've been driving for 24 years and never had an accident that I wouldn't have had if I had been wearing different tyres or that could possibly have made any difference.

I drive everyday and never experience anything that pushes my tyres to lose any grip. (except ice & snow see below)

For all intents and purposes they are the same, spending more money on a brand is a waste of money - for me.

You do what you want to do, but don't tell me I would experience anything different just because I had tyres with a fancy name on them.

The only caveat I will mention is that I will be prepared (in the future) to have a full set of wheels with Nokian winters for use when the ice and snow arrives. At present I just keep driving on what I have at the time, I do occasionaly slip on ice and and compacted snow and I park the car at the bottom of the hill over night - impossible to get up the hill in any tyres, there isn't a single car which makes it up the hill except a 4X4. I doubt I'd do it even with Nokians on, but the reason for the Nokians would be for the ice I encounter out on the main roads.

Wig

red_eye wrote: »

the effectiveness of your brakes are dependent on your tyres

Tyres have limited grip, this is shared by accelerating, braking and turning therefore grip used for braking cannot be used for turning. The budgt range of tyres have smaller grip circles http://f1-dictionary.110mb.com/traction_circle.html.

Yes they have to be made to pass a standard premiums exceed the standerd and have a better thread design to remove water.

the price difference is not much, for my car 155/60/13 poverty spec tyres are 39, 48 for mid, 50 for premium from blackcircles

Not sure what your point is?

for me 175/65/14

cheap = £28
mid £50
Expensive = £70 - £85

That's virtually half the price.

sunshinetours

Wig wrote: »

They are the same to me, everyday I experience nothing fom my tyres except what I expect from them. They support my car and help to iron out the bumps in the road, I've been driving for 24 years and never had an accident that I wouldn't have had if I had been wearing different tyres or that could possibly have made any difference.

I drive everyday and never experience anything that pushes my tyres to lose any grip. (except ice & snow see below)

For all intents and purposes they are the same, spending more money on a brand is a waste of money - for me.

You do what you want to do, but don't tell me I would experience anything different just because I had tyres with a fancy name on them.

The only caveat I will mention is that I will be prepared (in the future) to have a full set of wheels with Nokian winters for use when the ice and snow arrives. At present I just keep driving on what I have at the time, I do occasionaly slip on ice and and compacted snow and I park the car at the bottom of the hill over night - impossible to get up the hill in any tyres, there isn't a single car which makes it up the hill except a 4X4. I doubt I'd do it even with Nokians on, but the reason for the Nokians would be for the ice I encounter out on the main roads.

The point I believe bigjl was making is that your point of view is just that, one persons annecdotal evidence of what tehy perceive to be the case.
Manufacturers and others have tested many many different tyres in different conditions over the years and unless you are saying all those tests point on favour of cheap ditchfinders then it really means nothing.

By all means carry on with cheaper tyres and lets hope that that one time when you may need that extra grip your cheaper tyre rise to the occassion

I totally agree with you previously that eveything in life is a balance of risks, we clearly have differemt parameters of what consitutes an acceptable risk on certain things (no life assurance and you have a family??)

On the winters hopefully you will report back on whether you can get up the hill. A 4x4 is as useless as 2 wheel drive if the rubber isn't correct, as a singing and dancing X5 proved on our hill last year in the snow by trying and failing to get up a relatively short but steepish hill before sliding sideways into a car at the bottom. I got up and down the hill in all conditions on my winters in a rear wheel drive 300bhp beast without any drama

So moral of that story is that not all tyres are the same I guess....

jase1

You do what you want to do, but don't tell me I would experience anything different just because I had tyres with a fancy name on them.

Whatever your thoughts on the difference between good and bad tyres, this is completely true.

I have no problem whatsoever with people being choosy with anything they buy -- I am one of them, I never have been happy buying the cheapest tyres I can find.

However, this thread, and others like it, expose the naked snobbery and ignorance of many people on this subject. Time and time again we get the "Bridgestone/Goodyear/Dunlop/Continental/Pirelli/Michelin good, everything else bad" from people, along with the old chestnut about these brands lasting "twice as long" as "lesser" tyres.

Both of these claims are complete and utter tosh. As I've said before, if even Michelin only make the claim that their tyres last 30% longer, then the claim above is impossible because if it were true Michelin would use it.

sunshinetours

jase1 wrote: »

Whatever your thoughts on the difference between good and bad tyres, this is completely true.

.

Not necesarily. The name itself may not automatically mean the tyres are "better" (depends how you define that as well I guess) but you very rarely find cheap Chinese or real budget tyre at the top of the performance reviews.
You are simply more likely to find better comfort, lower noise levels and possibly reduced braking distances in the wet on some premium branded tyres for instance.

The info is out there its just looking for it - saying premium tyres are better than all budget tyres is as wrong as saying budget tyres are just as good as premium tyres - both statements are generalisations and not true

jase1

sunshinetours wrote: »

The info is out there its just looking for it - saying premium tyres are better than all budget tyres is as wrong as saying budget tyres are just as good as premium tyres - both statements are generalisations and not true

My point exactly. There is no "sliding scale" here -- the very worst "premium" tyre is likely to be worse than the very best "budget".

sunshinetours

jase1 wrote: »

My point exactly. There is no "sliding scale" here -- the very worst "premium" tyre is likely to be worse than the very best "budget".

You seemed to have missed my point which is you are more likely to find better tyres at the premium price end. Of course there will be some cross over as some tyres "outperform their price" and vice versa shall we say

jase1

"More likely" means nothing. Unless you're prepared to do the groundwork and actually work out what's best for your needs in a brand-agnostic manner, a choiced based on the brand-name written on the side is an invalid method of choosing anything and leaves you open to being ripped off.

Put it this way. If someone comes up to me and says "the Goodyear NCT5 is a great tyre", I'll listen to them, because by knowing the model number it's clear they've put at least some thought into their opinion. If they say "buy a Michelin, they're the dog's", they'll get short-shrift.

sunshinetours

jase1 wrote: »

"More likely" means nothing. Unless you're prepared to do the groundwork and actually work out what's best for your needs in a brand-agnostic manner, a choiced based on the brand-name written on the side is an invalid method of choosing anything and leaves you open to being ripped off.

Put it this way. If someone comes up to me and says "the Goodyear NCT5 is a great tyre", I'll listen to them, because by knowing the model number it's clear they've put at least some thought into their opinion. If they say "buy a Michelin, they're the dog's", they'll get short-shrift.

More likely does mean exactly that its "more likely than not". Most people don't do that level of research into tyres or any car parts and so you do get trusted brands, albeit with some fairly large caveats, those trusted brands are usually at least at the better end of quality

Are you saying by choosing any of the COntinental range of tyres over any of the Linglong range of tyres for instance, they are "most likely" going to have a higher quality of tyre that will outperform the Linglong on almost every category of test?

If not then fine we clearly are worlds apart on tyre opinion. i do think generalisations are dangerous and buying anything purely on manufacturer can be dangerous, I'll agree woth that.

jase1

Are you saying by choosing any of the COntinental range of tyres over any of the Linglong range of tyres for instance, they are "most likely" going to have a higher quality of tyre that will outperform the Linglong on almost every category of test?

Yes.

Are all Pirellis better than all Hankooks or Toyos though? Not so sure...