Have been so stupid (hangs head in shame)

Forreal

Hi,

You have clearly been the victim of crime - this guy has clearly come to the table (deal) with the intention of decieving you.

Civil complaints are those where the seller and consumer begin dealing with an honest intention and then something goes awry.

You need to put your case in writing and address it to the Police District Commander of the area where the male lives - this will be a Chief Inspector. If no joy here write to the Divisional Commander, usually a Chief Superindendant, if no joy then the Chief Constable, then the Police Authority and finally the IPCC (Independant Police Complaints Commission). You'll find all the names and addresses probably on the force website if not then call the force and ask for the details.

Don't get your hopes up if it turns into an enquiry - you still may not get anything back dependant on how the investigation/court disposal goes.

It is all to easy for forces to use the 'civil matter' excuse to wriggle out of investigating consumer crime.

Stick to your guns if you have the time/energy.

If not put this whole experience in a box and put it away, forget about it and have a great Christmas secure in the knowledge a great many people wish you well.


The best things in life are free - or discounted at the very least!!!

Amanda65

Thanks for the replies - Mandles a lovely thought but I really don't want anyone sending me money! If you read through the threads I am one of many who has been caught at the moment and my case is no more deserving than anyone elses AND I firmly believe that I have learnt a (very tough) lesson here. I am angry that the little s**t can get away with it but as many have said even if I get my day in court I doubt very much that he will have anything to pay me back with.

Thanks to MSE this year things aren't quite as bad as they could be, the site has definitely saved me over £150 this year - and although if I had a spare £150 I would rather have given it to charity it isn't going to make us destitute - and the DD's have still got Ipods as I bought them with Tesco points, not the most efficient way of using them I know but did mean that I didn't fork out real cash.

Fay will PM you - thanks for your support.

greenstreetprince

bump bump bump - nail the scammer through the moneyclaim website

Hotspur

Hi Amanda,

I've just come across this thread and have read it all with interest. Having a legal background in the consumer field I'd just like to confirm what a few others have said.

It is likely that the 'seller' has obtained property by deception, the property in question being your money, which is a criminal offence under the Theft Act 1968 (I think) (soon to be replaced with the Fraud Act 2006). An offence may have taken place where the deception took place or money was transferred so if you read an e mail at home that could be the place of the offence. (not 100% sure of that). In addition you would have a civil claim against the seller for not fulfilling their side of the contract i.e. suppling you with the goods.

From my experience many Police officers will say that this sort of 'con' is a civil matter to get rid of you as it takes too much time to investigate however if/when you get someone to listen they often find many similar instances of crime which add up to something worthwile for them. If I remember correctly there is at least one other person in a similar situation and if you can also use their experience in evidence it will go some way to indicating that this isn't a one off but a pattern of criminal behaviour.

I would suggest you write an old fashioned letter, listing your evidence inc. phone calls made & copies of e mails etc., to your local Police station with a copy to the Chief Constable and local councillor. It may take some time to get the Police to see things your way but the 'seller' has done it to you and another and will probably do it again to someone else.

I wish you good luck.

Blacksheep1979

Hi Amanda

Now I would definately pursue the police angle (as others have said - def covered by theft act), if they won't accept it put it in writing as a complaint. BUT first you are interested in getting your money back. If this is a case of the straw that breaks the camels back (crime wise) then you won't get any money if he's in prison. First thing to do is write a letter to his address (recorded delivery) to Mr. Scammer stating that he has 14 days to refund your money or you will proceed with legal action without further notice. Then issue a small claims court claim (either online moneyclaim.org I think or via courts on paper) after the 14 days expire. Carefully set out your case. Now unfortunatley if he contests it you'll have to go to his local court (but you can claim costs). You will win - even if he turns up. Take a friend along for support if you do end up going to court so as not to be intimidated by the surroundings and him. Now the best part, if he is there and agrees to a payment plan with the court and he misses 1 payment then you can get the court to instruct baliffs at his expense to visit him (this is also the case if he doesn't defend and doesn't pay). The baliffs, if they gain entry to the property can seize goods to the value of the debt. Basically you'll end up with your money and the more of a run arround he gives you the more it'll cost him.

Good luck. (not that you'll need it)

fuzzgun19

Amanda65 wrote:

It will cost £30 to process the claim apparently and I still have to get the money from him even if judgement is awarded in my favour - think I'm just throwing good money after bad!!!!

Just a thought - If you're on certain benefits, you dont have to pay the £30...

Murtle

argh....just read all this.....Amanda65 how did you get on with the Police??

M

x x

Avoriaz

Blacksheep1979 wrote:

…Then issue a small claims court claim …..The baliffs, if they gain entry to the property can seize goods to the value of the debt. Basically you'll end up with your money and the more of a run arround he gives you the more it'll cost him…

This will only work if he has assets that can be seized.

If he is a 20 year old living with his parents, it is quite possible that he has no assets. Bailiffs cannot seize his parents assets and it is very easy for him to claim that he owns nothing of value in the home. Bailiffs cannot seize his clothes etc.

Amanda could be throwing a lot of good money after bad. She will have to pay the court fee of £30 or whatever, plus bailiffs fees and will probably recover nothing. Sadly, it is impossible to get a scammer to pay his debts if he has no assets and has blown your £150 on drugs, lager or whatever.

Amanda, if you still want to pursue this, though I suspect you are probably trying to forget about it, your only option is to force the police to prosecute. Even then, even if he has a string of other offences and convictions, he will probably just get more probation. :mad: :rolleyes:
.

Amanda65

Hi all - and thanks to everyone who offered advice before Christmas about my ebay scam. I received a telephone call from Wiltshire police just before Christmas and the sergeant confirmed that the scammer was well known to them but said the reason that they couldn't proceed was because I had entered into a contract with the person and therefore that made it a civil case, not theft. His example was that if I went into a shop and walked out with the goods that would be theft but if I went in and said to the shopkeeper I was taking the goods and would be back later with the money and then didn't go back to pay that would be a civil case.

Having spent ages now agonising over this I think I am just going to have to put it down as a bad experience and very sharp learning curve. I do think that even if I win the court case it is unlikely he will have any seizable assets and therefore I am just wasting more money. I am just so gutted and would much rather have given the money away to a geunine cause than had that scumbag just waste it. It has not put me off of ebay as I have had some very good purchases from geunine sellers, I do now realilse however that a BIN offer over the email is not covered by Ebay rules, I will only ever pay through Paypal and will be very very careful about who I buy from in future.

hollydays

I hope someone else can answer the questions re the contract.I do not understand enough about them.

A person walked out with the goods saying they would be back with the money,but was being dishonest,and didnt ever intend to come back.The contract is not legally binding because it was entred into dishonestly..Deception?

If a person walked out with the goods, fully intending to pay but became,for example, insolvent(or any other number of reasons)
and could not pay,and held their hands up to this. Civil matter?

Any thoughts on this?Is there not a difference?
Anyone know?

I know you have made up your mind,but it may be to the benefit of others who find themselves in this situation.

Shame there isnt a legal forum that a question could be posted on.