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Problem tenants, advice needed
AnnaEBA
Posts: 13 Forumite
I'd appreciate some advice on an issue I have with my current tenants. I use a local lettings agency to manage the property, and so far they've been worse than useless!
The tenants moved in at the end of September last year on a 12 month AST. The tenancy was signed and witnessed by the tenants by the lettings agent and forwarded to me for my signature. They paid 1 month's deposit (which I have protected) and the rent is up to date - no problems on that score, and they were fully credit checked. However, I have not yet signed the tenancy agreement for several reasons.
My previous tenants had been in the property for some time and after they moved out it was evident that they had been concealing problems with the property behind furniture & possessions - a lot of mould, damaged paintwork and stained carpets. However, as the new tenants were moving in the following day there was no time to do anything other than clean the carpets and walls as best we could. The new tenants, to give them their credit, were understanding, forwarded a full list of problems they'd identified and said they were happy for contractors to attend to start working on what needed to be done urgently. They asked for permission to redecorate the front bedroom and I gave it.
And now the problems started - I asked my contractor to visit the property about 2 weeks into the new tenancy to assess what needed to be done and he advised that some of the work required extensive repairs and that could only be safely done with the property empty. As I had not signed the contract, I therefore asked my agent to communicate with the new tenants asking them to leave by the end of the month. They refused, stating that they felt they had a 12 month tenancy and were not prepared to move so quickly, but would co-operate with the repairs as best they could.
I sought again the advice of the builder who said that if I left the major works for 12 months it could compromise the property significantly, but that 6 months would probably be OK, as long as I made good as much as possible quickly. When the agent communicated this to the tenants they again refused, stating that they had budgeted tightly to be able to move, had incurred approximately £900 costs to move (they quoted Sky & BT reconnection fees, van rental, agency costs plus a few other things) and were again not prepared to move. They then had the nerve to suggest that if my trusted contractor was not prepared to do the work with the property occupied that I seek the advice of several other builders to determine if that was truly the case. They offered to take 2 weeks leave from work after Christmas and go away, or to move into temporary accommodation at my expense. By now I have serious concerns about these tenants as I feel they are being overly demanding. They claim they have taken legal advice despite claiming they are not in a financial position to move again.
Faced with no other option I advised the contractor to start work on what could be done. To make life even more difficult one of the tenants apparently works late shifts and so sleeps into the late morning, so the contractor could only work in the afternoons even though the tenants said they were fine with him coming in whenever, as long as he stayed out of the bedroom.
Most of the work that could be completed was done before Christmas. The tenants sent a further email to the agent in early January confirming what had been done, and listing what they felt still needed to be done. The list is mainly as follows: radiator in the back bedroom cannot be turned down or off, porch door cannot be locked, and major mould in the box room. These were on the original email but haven't been dealt with yet, and I had not intended to deal with them at all until they moved out, as I was not intending to extend or renew the tenancy.
And now the real problems start. The agent conducted an inspection a couple of weeks ago and discovered that despite the tenancy agreement stating no pets, two cats were in the property. She believed they had been soiling the carpets. There were also two other people in the property. The front bedroom has been redecorated but not to a professional standard. She challenged the tenants over the other residents and the cats and was told that they were friends who had had some major problems at their property and had to move out urgently (I believe they mentioned a fire), and were staying with them until they could move into a new rented property. The cats apparently belong to them. The tenants are maintaining the cats are litter trained and that the slight smell of cat pee was from the previous tenants cat. I've since had the contractor attend the house without the tenants knowledge and he confirms the cats have gone and apparently so have the other adults. However, I believe they were in breach of their tenancy by having them there, even temporarily.
The agent arranged for the builder to go around to the property again to start some other works, but apparently gave them the wrong date. They then sent her an email stating that they would not allow any further access unless she contacts them by telephone giving at least 24 hours notice or by email with 72 hours notice.
They've sent another email stating that they've asked the council to assess the state of the property and have added a warning that they are sure that both she and I know that they have powers to force me to do the works required to make the front bedroom habitable. In the same email they ask for a rent reduction to reflect the fact that they believe that room is uninhabitable and has never been. They've also said that unless action is taking to resolve the other problems they feel they have no option but to arrange for them to be completed with any cost to be reimbursed by me or deducted from future rent payments.
All in all, they're extremely demanding and I would like them out of my house immediately. However, I suspect they will refuse to go so I would like to know what I can do to get them out. As I have not signed the tenancy, can I say that they don't have one and start eviction proceedings? Can I get them out because they temporarily had cats in the property?
The tenants moved in at the end of September last year on a 12 month AST. The tenancy was signed and witnessed by the tenants by the lettings agent and forwarded to me for my signature. They paid 1 month's deposit (which I have protected) and the rent is up to date - no problems on that score, and they were fully credit checked. However, I have not yet signed the tenancy agreement for several reasons.
My previous tenants had been in the property for some time and after they moved out it was evident that they had been concealing problems with the property behind furniture & possessions - a lot of mould, damaged paintwork and stained carpets. However, as the new tenants were moving in the following day there was no time to do anything other than clean the carpets and walls as best we could. The new tenants, to give them their credit, were understanding, forwarded a full list of problems they'd identified and said they were happy for contractors to attend to start working on what needed to be done urgently. They asked for permission to redecorate the front bedroom and I gave it.
And now the problems started - I asked my contractor to visit the property about 2 weeks into the new tenancy to assess what needed to be done and he advised that some of the work required extensive repairs and that could only be safely done with the property empty. As I had not signed the contract, I therefore asked my agent to communicate with the new tenants asking them to leave by the end of the month. They refused, stating that they felt they had a 12 month tenancy and were not prepared to move so quickly, but would co-operate with the repairs as best they could.
I sought again the advice of the builder who said that if I left the major works for 12 months it could compromise the property significantly, but that 6 months would probably be OK, as long as I made good as much as possible quickly. When the agent communicated this to the tenants they again refused, stating that they had budgeted tightly to be able to move, had incurred approximately £900 costs to move (they quoted Sky & BT reconnection fees, van rental, agency costs plus a few other things) and were again not prepared to move. They then had the nerve to suggest that if my trusted contractor was not prepared to do the work with the property occupied that I seek the advice of several other builders to determine if that was truly the case. They offered to take 2 weeks leave from work after Christmas and go away, or to move into temporary accommodation at my expense. By now I have serious concerns about these tenants as I feel they are being overly demanding. They claim they have taken legal advice despite claiming they are not in a financial position to move again.
Faced with no other option I advised the contractor to start work on what could be done. To make life even more difficult one of the tenants apparently works late shifts and so sleeps into the late morning, so the contractor could only work in the afternoons even though the tenants said they were fine with him coming in whenever, as long as he stayed out of the bedroom.
Most of the work that could be completed was done before Christmas. The tenants sent a further email to the agent in early January confirming what had been done, and listing what they felt still needed to be done. The list is mainly as follows: radiator in the back bedroom cannot be turned down or off, porch door cannot be locked, and major mould in the box room. These were on the original email but haven't been dealt with yet, and I had not intended to deal with them at all until they moved out, as I was not intending to extend or renew the tenancy.
And now the real problems start. The agent conducted an inspection a couple of weeks ago and discovered that despite the tenancy agreement stating no pets, two cats were in the property. She believed they had been soiling the carpets. There were also two other people in the property. The front bedroom has been redecorated but not to a professional standard. She challenged the tenants over the other residents and the cats and was told that they were friends who had had some major problems at their property and had to move out urgently (I believe they mentioned a fire), and were staying with them until they could move into a new rented property. The cats apparently belong to them. The tenants are maintaining the cats are litter trained and that the slight smell of cat pee was from the previous tenants cat. I've since had the contractor attend the house without the tenants knowledge and he confirms the cats have gone and apparently so have the other adults. However, I believe they were in breach of their tenancy by having them there, even temporarily.
The agent arranged for the builder to go around to the property again to start some other works, but apparently gave them the wrong date. They then sent her an email stating that they would not allow any further access unless she contacts them by telephone giving at least 24 hours notice or by email with 72 hours notice.
They've sent another email stating that they've asked the council to assess the state of the property and have added a warning that they are sure that both she and I know that they have powers to force me to do the works required to make the front bedroom habitable. In the same email they ask for a rent reduction to reflect the fact that they believe that room is uninhabitable and has never been. They've also said that unless action is taking to resolve the other problems they feel they have no option but to arrange for them to be completed with any cost to be reimbursed by me or deducted from future rent payments.
All in all, they're extremely demanding and I would like them out of my house immediately. However, I suspect they will refuse to go so I would like to know what I can do to get them out. As I have not signed the tenancy, can I say that they don't have one and start eviction proceedings? Can I get them out because they temporarily had cats in the property?
0
Comments
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hahahahahahahahaha
:silenced:0 -
Seem like it's pretty much entirely your fault. You should have ensured the property was in a good state before letting it out. They've paid you rent, so they have at least 6 months security.
You need to bribe them with lots of ££££ to move, basically.0 -
Seem like it's pretty much entirely your fault. You should have ensured the property was in a good state before letting it out. They've paid you rent, so they have at least 6 months security.
You need to bribe them with lots of ££££ to move, basically.
They insisted on moving in so soon after the last tenants moved out.
They've had cats in a property which was let as no pets, does that not count for anything?
They also don't have a tenancy agreement, I still have both here and haven't signed them.0 -
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The person at fault is YOU not them.
You rented out a dive not fit for habitation and it still isn't. You failed to inspect and rectify problems as you were so keen to avoid an empty property not bringing any money in.
If you have a scrap of decency you will refund all rent money so far paid and come to some arrangment so that you assist them in finding a new property to rent. That way they may feel that its better to leave than have your 'bodge the builder' bloke round every afternoon causing mess and disturbance.
Then you can get the work done properly and quickly.0 -
They insisted on moving in so soon after the last tenants moved out.
They've had cats in a property which was let as no pets, does that not count for anything?
They also don't have a tenancy agreement, I still have both here and haven't signed them.
No, having pets is not an evictable offence.
Have you been taking rent? If so, then you have agreed to the tenancy agreement, whether you have signed it or not.
You really don't have a clue about being a landlord, do you?0 -
The_Drama_Llama wrote: »No, having pets is not an evictable offence.
Have you been taking rent? If so, then you have agreed to the tenancy agreement, whether you have signed it or not.
You really don't have a clue about being a landlord, do you?
I've been a landlord for a long time, thanks, and have never had a problem before.
They're in breach of the tenancy agreement by having pets, even if they claim they weren't theirs.0 -
As sequence says, you'll have to buy them off and forgo some of the pedantic niceties about the inventory. They have budgeted for a deposit and referencing fees and fee paying fees and fees atop that. And now they have to pay for another removal and fork out all over again - they may not have the cash to fund another deposit, so unless you are going to help them out, you are stuck with them. Whether or not you have signed is academic now, unless you have put the rent aside and are going to hand it back. Giving them the keys and taking their money repeatedly is about as good as signing the agreement YOU [or your agent] gave them to sign.
And as for getting the contractor to enter without their knowledge to spy on them, you are getting yourself in too deep. And the lesson for next time - don't be so eager to prevent a void. Leave yourself time to fix any problems before the next tenants move in.Hi, we’ve had to remove your signature. If you’re not sure why please read the forum rules or email the forum team if you’re still unsure - MSE ForumTeam0
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