Redundancy Help

geordiepip

Hi,

My department is going through a restructure at present and am concerned with regards what might happen.

New roles were advertised (with different job titles etc) but there was only 1 position at the same grade as me, where 3 people currently all do this.

I didnt want to apply for the role as I dont want to be in the department any more and wanted a change - probably outside of the company.

Am I right in thinking that as the new role advertised has a different title and job spec, that my current role is officially 'redundant' and that I would have to be offered redundancy at some stage?

I feel that the company will try to force me into a different role which I dont want to do. The background about my grade etc is that within my role there are 4 levels, 1,2,3 & 4, of which I am a 4. All of the levels have a different salary and role specification. I have previously completed role 3 (but this was over 4-5 years ago and this role has changed since then). There are no other roles with a level 4 within the company.

Basically I feel they will present one of these roles to me - can i reject it and go forward for redundancy?

I am very nervous about this whole situation and would welcome some advice on how to play this!!

Thanks

getmore4less

Any alternative roll needs to be a suitable alternative.

pay is one reason for it not to be suitable.

people should have officialy been put at risk and notified they are in a consultancy period has this happened?

have a read through this is gives an outline of what should be happening.

http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=747

geordiepip

the consultation period ended this week. I am getting a letter from my manager on monday apparantly.

Can they not offer me a lower job but freeze my salary - thus avoiding this being deemed as 'unsuitable'??

I have also heard that if i am offered a redeployment role and i decline it, then i cannot move forward for redundancy?

I have worked for the company for 11 years and to be honest I would rather leave and start a new career somewhere else, so redundancy is the option I am truly hoping for.

I am so nervous and confused at the moment!

getmore4less

added the link missed in the last post.


Redeployment still has to be suitable alternative.

freezing pay can get round the reduced pay aspect but there are other related factors like status.

look at the jobs seriously and see how different they are from what you do and make the list of things that make them unsuitable.

geordiepip

Hi

An update and request for further advice...

I have received another letter stating that I am at risk of redundancy because 'there isnt a requirement to carry out the work I am currently doing'. In a subsequent meeting with my manager I said that I had been actively looking on my company vacancy board but there wasnt anything which appealed to me. My manager then started saying I was wasnt being realistic as she feels I am waiting for the perfect job rather than taking something that might fit some of my current skills.

After over 35 mins, my manager then asked if I thought redundancy would be an option within this process, to which point I said that if a role didnt become available which appealed to me then that would be the natural route this process would take. This was met with some strange looks and an intimation that this wouldnt be the case.

Basically, I feel I am being pressured to consider roles which I dont want. Am I right to stick to my guns as they have to offer me redundancy due to the circumstances? I want to leave as I know the career path I now want to take so leaving is what I want to get out of this situation.

If you need any further information to help give me more of an informed opinion, then please let me know.

geordiepip

Hi all,

I would really appreciate some opinions on my situation as think I have my next formal meeting with my manager next week...

unholyangel

Sorry i cant be of more help but perhaps this will give you some information to think about or that you didnt previously know?

http://www.worksmart.org.uk/rights/my_employer_has_offered_me_an_alternative

There is also another page on that site that states:
"So, if you are thinking of rejecting an alternative job offer, take advice, and do so in good time. You will be in a stronger position if you at least give a job alternative that might look suitable to an outsider a try and then clearly give reasons based on your experience of the job to show that it is unsuitable"

geordiepip

I've had a further meeting with my manager and explained why the 4 other jobs within my grade banding (all lower than my current role) are not suitable for me, citing:

potential changes in hours (leading to increased childcare costs as well as problems collecting kids from nursery as I have to do this on some days my wife is at work).

changes in salary (stating that if they froze my salary, would this be permanently? as well as with our annual pay increase in Jan if my salary was frozen I would then be worse off as my salary had not risen in line with the rise in living expenses!)

Change in work type - all four roles are consdirably different to my roles and very technical where mine is solely people focussed.

Change in status - being at the top of my current grade banding, any other job would mean career progression has gone back over by at least 2-3 years.


I was also advised to look at the company jobs board and highlight any roles which may have been suitable and why they were ultimately not. These were due to travel as many are at our head office over 70 miles away.

I have since been told I am now officially a 'redeployee' and am awaiting interview processes for people who have aspired for higher grade roles to be completed and placing of people to begin.

Have I done the right thing by pre-empting any offer of the roles or does this just mean they have time to pick holes in my argument??

I'm still on the knife-edge of excitement of leaving and potentially starting a new career somewhere else and that of potentially thinking 'will i get another job' in the current climate!!

Help put my mind at rest (if you can)...

geordiepip

HELP...

I've had my next meeting with my manager today and have been told redundancy is NOT an option.

I have been offered the P1 role (see my previous notes - I am P4 with 2 other levels between us) although all these roles are cosidered in 'level 8 banding'.

The differences in the roles (simplified) are:

• £10k in pay (although I know they might freeze my pay)
• Working hours could change
• New role is 100% customer facing, whereas current role is 0% customer facing (have been advised that although I dont actually speak to customers currently, this is something which I could still be asked to do and is in my contract?)
• The work I would be carrying out is completely different - I would be dealing with customers enquiries/complaints etc rather than providing coaching and support to other managers which I currently do

Should I sit tight and potentially go to an employment tribunal or take the offer which is on the table (which I dont want to do at all). I have been advised they may potentially come back to me and offer me the P2 or P3 roles further down the line. I've been told that an employment tribunal could cost between £10k-£15k which is very worrying for a parent with two children to support.

I need advice as this is properly playing with my head...

WombleSW20_2

It does sound like you need some specific legal advice about what your rights are. Do you have access to any legal advice (normally helplines) via the company or your unions? If not, it would be money well spent speaking to an employment law specialist.

geordiepip

I've called the company support helpline and they have stated pretty much the same as me - about the role having to be reasonable & suitable.

They suggested an initial consultation with a solicitor who specialises in employment law, however the couple I phoned said it would cost £198 per hour + VAT. This is a lot of money to pay out bearing in mind I have a family etc and little income.

I guess i'm just nervous about the possibility of going to an employment tribunal and losing as this could cost over £10k which we cannot afford. Part of me is really confident that it would be successful but its a massive risk to take...