Free solar panel discussion

Cardew

ddavis wrote: »

Are you allowing for the saving on what you would have used as well? You won't be paying out for it, so whilst it isn't an "income" it is still a ROI which should be allowed for.

I'm currently with EON, 1,343 kw/h just cost me £166. And i'm on a very good rate.

Yes as I said in the quote you used.

might produce 2,000kWh a year. Using half of that in the house,

i.e. 1,000kWh @10p = £100 selling back the other 1,000 units at an unsubsidised rate would be £50(if you were lucky)

Don't forget your 1,343kWh for £166 includes the high priced Tier 1 units.

Anything you use in the house only saves the Tier 2 priced units as the occupant already has 'used up' their Tier1 allocation.

thedj

So Cardew

You seem to be font of all knowledge on all things solar and electricity and saving money.

Please tell us what you do regarding the above instead of ripping into everything anybody posts on here about it. I am presuming your house is the perfect eco-friendly establishment with a system that is the optimum example of a good financial investment PLUS ultimate low carbon power generation.

I reckon to quote you that you are perhaps talking the most 'nonsense'.

Do you work for the utility companies? Oil companies? What is your agenda?

I would suggest to any future readers that they take your comments lightly unless you can show you have got it spot on and the rest of us are misguided fools which is what you seem to regularly suggest?

Equaliser123

thedj wrote: »

Do you work for the utility companies? Oil companies? What is your agenda?

I would suggest to any future readers that they take your comments lightly unless you can show you have got it spot on and the rest of us are misguided fools which is what you seem to regularly suggest?

To be fair to Cardew - and whilst I don't always agree with him - his knowledge does seem to be pretty good.

Your understanding of what a 2.2kwp system can produce is far from realistic.

Cardew

thedj,
Would it not be better to address the issues and dispute anything you think I have wrong?

May I remind you that you stated you were "happy for you to investigate it and question". Apparently that writ doesn't run to telling you you are wrong in virtually all the major points in your post.

On a Money Saving internet Forum if you post information that is flawed, and invite investigations, you should not be surprised, and seemingly hurt, when your invitation is accepted.

I am quite prepared to debate how I believe have got my comments 'spot on' with regard to your posts; perhaps you would care to point out where I am 'talking the most nonsense.'

Mary_Hartnell

This morning I was intrigued to hear a namesake pontificating about the Feed in Tariff, together with someone called "Yeo" on the BBC radio 4 "Today" programme (Yeo is easy to remember because my "Hartnells" came from Dorset, not a million miles from Yeovil;))


I'm not quite sure what they said but, I have an interest in the way subsidies "twist" the way people behave and bolster vested interests.

The item was headlined "The sun sets on Feed in Tarriffs" (thus demonstrating that the interviewer/journalist does not understand the complexity of the new carbon economy either)

So I have checked with Google and turned up the following links:

http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/Resources/Energy-saving-news/Renewable-energy2/Govt-proposes-reduced-feed-in-tariff-for-large-projects/%28energysavingtrust%29/832646

http://www.timyeo.org.uk/issueshow.aspx?id=32&ref=10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqZPD78DjZA&NR=1

With the serendipity of searching the internet I've found a way for those people with gas boilers to get in on the FiT.

The Noddy version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh48HwjLkgQ&feature=player_embedded

Something a bit more technical:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQXURO-3xrI&feature=player_embedded
http://blogit.realwire.com/Feed-in-Tariff-What-is-it-are-you-eligible-and-how-to-claim

So I issue a challenge can someone (Cardew?) with a first class brain.

1. Evaluate the combined heat and power FiT deal in the gas boiler.

2. Translate the acronyms used in the video presentation by my namesake Gaynor Hartnell.


Mary.

Cardew

Mary,

Not sure I understand your question re gas boiler and FIT.

I am watching the cricket with a laptop(on my lap!!)so haven't listened to all Ms Hartnell's presentation. However her opening was talking about ROC(Renewable Obligations Certificate) and FIT(Feed in Tariff).

For domestic customers, subsidies were paid under the ROC system prior to the introduction of FIT. Whilst you could get a grant(usually £2,500) for PV panels it was far less lucrative than than FITs. The point being made was you could't have both schemes, or indeed systems installed before July 2009 cannot elect to have FITs

However turning to Gas boilers and FIT. It makes no difference what form of heating is in the house - gas, oil, solid fuel, electric etc - FIT are payable as long as you are connected to mains electricity and the system is installed by an approved firm.

grahamc2003

thedj wrote: »

So Cardew

You seem to be font of all knowledge on all things solar and electricity and saving money.

Please tell us what you do regarding the above instead of ripping into everything anybody posts on here about it. I am presuming your house is the perfect eco-friendly establishment with a system that is the optimum example of a good financial investment PLUS ultimate low carbon power generation.

I reckon to quote you that you are perhaps talking the most 'nonsense'.

Do you work for the utility companies? Oil companies? What is your agenda?

I would suggest to any future readers that they take your comments lightly unless you can show you have got it spot on and the rest of us are misguided fools which is what you seem to regularly suggest?

What a shame you had to post that thedj, I thought from your previous posts that you were appreciative of Cardew correcting your very numerous errors you have posted.

I was about to apologise to you for taking the mick in a previous post, but I don't think I'll bother now. (In fact I will, sorry for taking the mick).

I simply don't know what it is about all these 'renewable' or 'green' technologies which makes people want to exist in some sort of dreamworld where facts simply don't matter, and everyone is happiest to live in their delusions that they can stick a solar panel up, then they can boil the kettle for free forever more, and thousands of other wishful thinking illogicalities. Surely, if you incorrectly think that, don't you want someone who understands the issues to correct you?

I dispair about almost everything in these 'green' technologies. The whole area is just full of BS - even the energy saving trust, who many turn to for advice, seem not to understand even the basics, judging by a thread on these boards, where answers to questions were simply incorrect, and exposing questions from myself went unanswered. The head is an architect (i.e. untrained deeply in energy and power issues which are the basis of all this stuff). No wonder the general public are confused! It's a little like new techniques in brain surgery being led by an accountant, with teams of social workers answering any questions anyone may have, and any brain surgeons are abused when they give their view.

I'm afraid I can see that Cardew is correcting your views with the realities of the situation. You may not like that reality, and it may not be what you have been led to expect, but at least you now know what the reality is. Of course, you are still at liberty to believe what the salesman told you - that's up to you.

Mary_Hartnell

Thanks for you research so far.

You have not yet checked out one of the links.

The Baxi Ecogen is a micro-CHP boiler. CHP stands for 'combined heat and power'. This means the Baxi Ecogen is a dual energy system, so at the same time as providing efficient gas central heating and hot water like any other boiler, it also generates up to 1kWh of electricity.

In the winter at supper time when we need it and when the PV panels are generating zilch.
Logically these "winter" units should be more valuable than the 41.3p summer units but when it comes to taxes and subsidies logic seems to go out of the window.

Having now found this - I think I agree with the poster of the blog that the Germans have stolen a march on the rest of us in the direction of the intelligent grid: Bit of a shortage in Tonbridge Wells? Press a button and turn on the CHP machine in Pembury hospital?
http://www.heatingandventilating.net/blog/view_entry.asp?id=117

It looks like the FiT for gas boilers is currently only 10p for generation (+3p for exports) BUT my guess is that Baxi are haggling for some of the changes being made to the PV FiT. (PV : Photo Voltaic & FiT : Feed in Tariff : a subsidy for generating electricity from sunlight plus an additional payment for putting back your surplus into the national grid).
http://www.mrw.co.uk/news/decc-statistics-reveal-that-no-ad-or-chp-have-signed-up-to-the-fit-scheme/8606472.article


I'm sure there'll soon be a scam where someone runs mains from one property into a UPS/inverter in another property and claims FITS.

I don't think there can be many "rent a boiler" schemes on offer, just boiler room scams:rotfl:

Mary

It's a little like new techniques in brain surgery being led by an accountant

I think everything in this country is now run by accountants, including the hospitals - the government has run out of money.

PeterZ_2

Mary_Hartnell wrote: »

I think everything in this country is now run by accountants, including the hospitals - the government has run out of money.

Sorry Mary, its even worse than that, its not just that we have run out of money, we have a huge debt and deficit!!

The UK is now a net importer of energy, as oil costs rise will all start to feel the pain, not just at the petrol pumps but every aspect of the modern lifestyles we like to lead.

A small amount of pain now getting renewables (and nuclear, we have no choice) up and running will reap rewards at a later date (within the next 10 years) as energy (oil) prices sky rocket.

PeterZ_2

thedj wrote: »

So Cardew



I reckon to quote you that you are perhaps talking the most 'nonsense'.

Do you work for the utility companies? Oil companies? What is your agenda?

I saw a post on here somewhere that said that Cardew works for an energy company which would explain his knowledge in this area.

While I don't agree with his anti renewable views, and it would appear he has an agenda, I would not say that he posts nonsense. In general, his posts appear to technically correct.

The oil companies do of course have a serious campaign to discredit renewables and nuclear. If we had nukes all over the country, electric cars, an alternative for oil based plastics, pharma and fertilisers then the oil companies would be bust.:T

Getting off the oil hook is going to be incredibly hard. I would like to see some positive suggestions from Cardew for once, rather than picking at flaws in other peoples posts. Not that I'm saying there is anything wrong with pointing out peoples errors!