UK carriers response to Apples iphone 4 refund announcement

Oscar_The_Grouch

swilliam wrote: »

I suggest you take your experience and work for Trading Standards.

I sourced my advice from them before posting on here. The SOGA will PROTECT you in the case of the iphone 4.

Now who do i believe ? The Judge John Deed of MSE or a TSO.......hmmmm ! Let me think .

"Judge John Deed"? Was that the best you could come up with?

You believe who you want; I'm not going to lose any sleep over it. The thing is that your rather oversized post was based on "what someone else told me" rather than "what I know to be the law". My post, on the other hand, was backed up by the actual legislation concerned (with a link that you probably didn't bother to follow), combined with over 20 years dealing with contracts and contract law.

It is entirely up to you, but I know where I'm going to put my faith.

Andyblizz

MarkCox wrote: »

Hi all, just recived an e-mail from Tesco saying they will be refunding my phone as long as I return within 30 days (as per Apple's policy), so sounds good news! I'll try tomorrow and let you know if all goes smoothly in store.

But be advised of this hidden gem in there T&C if you return the phone in the cooling of period.

3.3 If you use the Tesco Mobile Pay Monthly Service during the Cooling off Period, and you subsequently cancel your Service Agreement in accordance with this paragraph 3, you will incur the cost of any usage you have made of the Tesco Mobile Pay Monthly Service during the Cooling-off Period. All calls, texts, picture messaging and data usage will be charged at the full rate set out on www.tescomobile.com. Any inclusive or discounted rates otherwise available on your tariff will not be applied.

Remember that Tesco data charge is £4 per MB.

I have had my iPhone 4 , 10 days and would have over £600 in data charges if i wanted to return my iPhone.

The fact the whole contract would only cost me £670 including handset price. But lucky for me i dont suffer from the dropped calls.

gjchester

swilliam wrote: »

I suggest you take your experience and work for Trading Standards.

I sourced my advice from them before posting on here. The SOGA will PROTECT you in the case of the iphone 4.

Now who do i believe ? The Judge John Deed of MSE or a TSO.......hmmmm ! Let me think .

Trading standards and Consumer direct often give advice that is right in most cases but not specific enough in call. Mobile contracts are not really one contract, but in fact two, one for the phone one the airtime service.

Your right under the SOGA you should be able to return the phone as faulty. However you will most likely be unable to cancel the airtime agreement, as thats a seperate contract and it's specifically worded so a damaged / broken / lost phone is not cause to cancel.

Supply of the phone and supply of the airtime are two seperate agreements. The airtime provider is providing you with the facility to make calls regardless of if you do so or not. It's not there problem that your hardware (ie the phone) cannot do so due to a fault. I appreciate that in many cases the provider and the airtime may appear to be the same people, but you'll find they are seperate entities in the same company.

gjchester

rogertyler wrote: »

I disagree with those who have said the phone has nothing to do with the contract - on the contrary, it has quite a lot to do with the contract. Approach any network and request a 24 month sim-only contract and take note of the pcm price, then ask for the same deal with an iPhone4 and take note how much higher the pcm price is! In effect you are paying for the handset through the contract, therefore it stands to reason that the phone is indeed tied in with the contract.

Correct. You have to pay for the phone in terms of a higher monthly charge, or a Handset fee or both. My Iphone plan is £35 to me or £20 sim only.

And the fact the phone was £170 not £500 needs to be bourne in mind. The subsidy on the phone £330 equates to £18, Add tha tto the £20 sim only deal and your about the same price.

However the fact remains the phone becomes yours at the time of purchase, it's not a hire purchase plan. You do pay the subsidy back over the contracy though, but then the Phone company knows you will be a customer for that long.

That said the hardware supply and the airtime agreement are seperate legal entities, they are only tied together in that the phone is subsidised at the time of purchase, after that they are not related.

rogertyler wrote: »

If you fail to pay your bills, you are in breach of the contract and the phone will be blacklisted. How can they blacklist a phone if the phone has nothing to do with the contract?

They bar the SIM not the phone. Phones are only blacklisted if reported stolen.

swilliam

gjchester wrote: »

Trading standards and Consumer direct often give advice that is right in most cases but not specific enough in call. Mobile contracts are not really one contract, but in fact two, one for the phone one the airtime service.

.

I did ask Trading Standards with direct reference to the current iPhone problems. They said they have received many calls regarding this
and have looked into the current legislation. They have deemed a refund is within the boundaries of the SOGA.

But I can only quote someone who actually works in this field and does the job of protecting the consumer.

If I want to know about sinks, I ask a plumber.;)

Oscar_The_Grouch wrote: »

My post, on the other hand, was backed up by the actual legislation concerned,combined with over 20 years dealing with contracts and contract law.

.

Good for you. I take it you dont do sinks as well then ?

Exhortation

MarkCox wrote: »

Hi all, just recived an e-mail from Tesco saying they will be refunding my phone as long as I return within 30 days (as per Apple's policy), so sounds good news! I'll try tomorrow and let you know if all goes smoothly in store.

Is there any chance you could copy the body of text here, removing any personal information, obviously? Cheers!

For anyone on O2, the latest update from them will be available at 18:00 today on the link below...

http://shop.o2.co.uk/new-iphone/iphone4press.html

Meanwhile, Vodafone still stubbornly refuse to change their policy.

DUTR

I'm surprised so many are so keen and eager to return the unit for a refund after purchasing it because it was so great

MarkCox

Hi Exhortation, well the plot thickens... yes I can get a refund but as per Andyblizz's experince I will need to pay for the data I've used at £4 per MB, which is more than the phone costs me!

Tesco have said the refund will be processed by Apple. What I'm not clear on is what price Apple will refund (i.e. list price or the reduced price due to contract term I get from Tesco). I'm going to pop in to the Apple store later to clarify that point on the off chance they will give me the higher value which may make paying Tesco off less painful.

e-mail from Tesco:

Dear Mark,

Thank you for e-mailing [EMAIL="support@tescomobile.com"]support@tescomobile.com[/EMAIL]

I have spoken to Apple on your behalf and they are saying you have 30 days to return this in and that will expire on the 24/7/10

If you have made an calls or text within this period of having your handset you will be billed for these on the next bill, please don’t cancel your direct debit until after the date is due as we need to calculate this for you.

If I can be of any further assistance, please feel free to email me.

Alternatively you can call our dedicated customer service line on 0845 301 4455.

Thank you


Tesco Mobile E-mail Customer Service Team

Exhortation

MarkCox wrote: »

Hi Exhortation, well the plot thickens... yes I can get a refund but as per Andyblizz's experince I will need to pay for the data I've used at £4 per MB, which is more than the phone costs me!

Tesco have said the refund will be processed by Apple. What I'm not clear on is what price Apple will refund (i.e. list price or the reduced price due to contract term I get from Tesco). I'm going to pop in to the Apple store later to clarify that point on the off chance they will give me the higher value which may make paying Tesco off less painful.

e-mail from Tesco:

Dear Mark,

Thank you for e-mailing [EMAIL="support@tescomobile.com"]support@tescomobile.com[/EMAIL]

I have spoken to Apple on your behalf and they are saying you have 30 days to return this in and that will expire on the 24/7/10

If you have made an calls or text within this period of having your handset you will be billed for these on the next bill, please don’t cancel your direct debit until after the date is due as we need to calculate this for you.

If I can be of any further assistance, please feel free to email me.

Alternatively you can call our dedicated customer service line on 0845 301 4455.

Thank you


Tesco Mobile E-mail Customer Service Team

Thanks for that. The plot certainly does thicken. Anyone who has used 500mb, for instance, is going to be looking at a £2000 bill for data alone. :eek:

What I can't get my head around is that Apple continue to sell the iPhone 4 with its known issue and people are still happy to buy it. I know it's not quite the same thing (as there's no safety issue) but it would've been like Toyota saying, yes, we know there's an issue with the accelerator jamming on some of our vehicles but for the next three months we're going to fit all our cars with bigger airbags.

Oscartheposcar

Exhortation wrote: »

What I can't get my head around is that Apple continue to sell the iPhone 4 with its known issue and people are still happy to buy it.

Maybe, just maybe, it really isn't a problem for using the phone for most people? It isn't for me. Most of the people complaining on message boards don't actually have an iPhone 4...

The clearest way of thinking about it is that instead of putting a small antenna inside a phone, Apple have put a small phone inside a large antenna. The antenna is susceptible to attenuation, but it gets a stronger signal in the first place due to being outside the phone. It can get a signal in places where other phones cannot at all (apparently it can work at -120dB signal strength or something technical like that). This design also allows for a larger battery etc while keeping the phone very thin, which is important for those of us who want our phones to fit in our pockets easily.

All that more than compensates for being able to make bars appear to drop. No dropped calls in my usage.

It must be annoying for people who really are unable to make a phone-call using the phone, but I'm really not sure how many people that affects - a self-selecting poll on a website like this is pretty meaningless.

Anyway, I'm guessing that a huge majority of people are enjoying using an excellent device.