Utility Warehouse (Telecom Plus) Discussion

HappyMJ

Meeper wrote: »

That's a different argument. The current argument is that UW have the highest prices, and so on. I am proving that they do not, and are perfectly competitive.

He could get cheaper on some online tariff, etc. But yes, he has saved money. And he could make additional savings in other areas as have been explained previously in the responses regarding telephony and bb.

Yes. UW have higher prices than his previous supplier. I know that I can see it.

Scottich Power Manweb region Standard tariff
Gas
£30 a quarter standing charge
3.762p/kWh
Electric
£30 a quarter standing charge
12.123p/kWh
Minus £16.80 duel fuel discount.

Utility Warehouse High User
Gas
£17.33 a quarter standing charge
3.951p/kWh
Electric
£17.33 a quarter standing charge
12.914p/kWh
Plus £18 per year membership for some online tariff however it's £30 per year for a traditional paper bill.

The some supplier he can switch to isn't just some supplier it's Npower the supplier of Utility Warehouse customers.
Npower Go Fix 8.
Gas
£32 a quarter standing charge
3.405p/kWh
Electric
£35.07 a quarter standing charge
11.183p/kWh
Minus £105 direct debit duel fuel annual discount
Minus £100 Love2Shop voucher promotion.
Minus £30 cashback for switching through MoneySupermarket

Cardew

Meeper wrote: »

That's a different argument. The current argument is that UW have the highest prices, and so on. I am proving that they do not, and are perfectly competitive.

He could get cheaper on some online tariff, etc. But yes, he has saved money. And he could make additional savings in other areas as have been explained previously in the responses regarding telephony and bb.

You still don't understand do you?

He wasn't paying £2,482 pa or if he did it was a mistake.

Even if he stayed with Scottish Power on his Standard tariff he would be paying less at £2169 than with UW at £2218

Why should be not get an internet tariff and pay £1,883 and pay £335 less than with UW.

So by any possible way at looking at the situation he is not saving money by joining UW but losing money.

Meeper

Cardew wrote: »

You still don't understand do you?

Yes, I understand perfectly. The numbers from his bill do not stack up to support your argument, so they must be wrong.

He wasn't paying £2,482 pa or if he did it was a mistake.

He did pay that much, and there is no evidence that it was a mistake.

Even if he stayed with Scottish Power on his Standard tariff he would be paying less at £2169 than with UW at £2218

Perhaps, as I have mentioned, he was on a tariff that was higher than the standard. No idea. But I'm sorry that you leave no room for thos possibility whilst asking me to leave room for a number of others.

Why should be not get an internet tariff and pay £1,883 and pay £335 less than with UW.

He is, of course, free to do that. Yet I saved him money based on his previous expenditure.

So by any possible way at looking at the situation he is not saving money by joining UW but losing money.

Afraid you are, simply, not correct. All of your protestations and figures from energyhelpline can't change the facts as I have presented them to you. I see that you are becoming a little irate at the argument and you are determined that I am "mistaken", however if you can't leave room for the possibility that this guy was paying a higher tariff than the standard one, then there's no point continuing the debate.

As I have previously stated, there's no point getting ratty when the facts don't support your position. For all our differences, I thought you were better than that.

HappyMJ

Meeper wrote: »

Yes, I understand perfectly. The numbers from his bill do not stack up to support your argument, so they must be wrong.

He did pay that much, and there is no evidence that it was a mistake.

Perhaps, as I have mentioned, he was on a tariff that was higher than the standard. No idea. But I'm sorry that you leave no room for thos possibility whilst asking me to leave room for a number of others.

He is, of course, free to do that. Yet I saved him money based on his previous expenditure.

Afraid you are, simply, not correct. All of your protestations and figures from energyhelpline can't change the facts as I have presented them to you. I see that you are becoming a little irate at the argument and you are determined that I am "mistaken", however if you can't leave room for the possibility that this guy was paying a higher tariff than the standard one, then there's no point continuing the debate.

As I have previously stated, there's no point getting ratty when the facts don't support your position. For all our differences, I thought you were better than that.

Which tariff then? I am using ScottishPower tariff table and the Standard tariff is the highest possible tariff.

Cardew

Meeper wrote: »

Really, this is getting silly. You ask for comment on the numbers, on specifics. I provide the specifics and the numbers. Then you say that I'm making it all up, I'm "mistaken", or go down the liar liar pants on fire route. If you ask for numbers, you can't complain when the numbers don't support your theory.

Sorry.

Yes it is getting silly, and you are just out of your depth.

The Standard Rate is the most expensive and he should have paid less than £2,000 in the preceding 12 months - not £2,482.

If you are a 'financial adviser' shouldn't you be getting on to your client and getting him a rebate for all the years he has been robbed.
Duty of care etc?

When first asked about your client you stated:

He took most of the stuff away from him, but my scribbled notes show 22,023 kWh for gas and 9,227 kWh for electricity for the year

Now you are absolutely sure that it was for a 12 month period, no arrears, no mistake in the bill. You haven't got the details of the price he paid per kWh - nothing.

Why not get hold of the bills and post details here and give an explanation - bet you won't!

The fact he would have been better off staying with Scottish Power on their standard Tariff, let alone taking gas and electricity from all the other companies, either on their standard tariff or internet tariffs, is of no concern.


Unbelievable!

Meeper

Which tariff then? I am using ScottishPower tariff table and the Standard tariff is the highest possible tariff.

No idea - he had been with them for many years. It is all irrelevant. The amount he was paying for his energy is the important thing here, and I'm afraid that if the facts as I have given them to you don't support your argument, there's not much I can do about that.

To reiterate, I have no idea what tariff he was on. No idea. None. But it was obviously more expensive than their current standard. Why? Don't know. A computer error at SP's end? Bad admin on their part? Don't know. Client doesn't care, he's ecstatic at the savings. If he doesn't care, why does everyone else? Oh, I know.....it's because it doesn't support your argument.

HappyMJ

Meeper wrote: »

No idea - he had been with them for many years. It is all irrelevant. The amount he was paying for his energy is the important thing here, and I'm afraid that if the facts as I have given them to you don't support your argument, there's not much I can do about that.

To reiterate, I have no idea what tariff he was on. No idea. None. But it was obviously more expensive than their current standard. Why? Don't know. A computer error at SP's end? Bad admin on their part? Don't know. Client doesn't care, he's ecstatic at the savings. If he doesn't care, why does everyone else? Oh, I know.....it's because it doesn't support your argument.

Because he is listening to a sales technique that promises him savings where none exists. He is trusting you and you have no idea what tariff he is on yet you claim he will save money. The tariff he was on is the most expensive ScottishPower tariff possible. It cannot be any higher unless he has actively switched to include a Unifi device or to include gas boiler cover or to include a green fund contribution. You said he hasn't switched for 7+ years so he would not have done any of that.

Meeper

Cardew wrote: »

Yes it is getting silly, and you are just out of your depth.

Now, who's resorting to being personal?

The Standard Rate is the most expensive and he should have paid less than £2,000 in the preceding 12 months - not £2,482.

Perhaps it is, and perhaps he should. But he didn't. Ergo, he has saved money by switching to UW.

If you are a 'financial adviser' shouldn't you be getting on to your client and getting him a rebate for all the years he has been robbed.
Duty of care etc?

Good try, but don't try to be smart and divert attention away from the facts here.

Now you are absolutely sure that it was for a 12 month period, no arrears, no mistake in the bill. You haven't got the details of the price he paid per kWh - nothing.

That's what was stated on his bill. There were no arrears, it was for a 12 month period.

Why not get hold of the bills and post details here and give an explanation - bet you won't!

I have posted details of the information on the bill already, we've been debating it all afternoon!

The fact he would have been better off staying with Scottish Power on their standard Tariff, let alone taking gas and electricity from all the other companies, either on their standard tariff or internet tariffs, is of no concern.

Why would you want to stay with a company who have been ripping you off for years? Sure, he could have found it slightly cheaper elsewhere, yet he didn't. I spoke to him and saved him hundreds of pounds per year. I haven't mentioned that he will also save an additional £132 per year off his phone & broadband package with BT (remember than from earlier....) and save money off his calls to his family in America and Australia. They are all ancillary savings, as are the savings he will make on the cashback card.

The guy is more than happy with the service I have given him and the savings he is making. Why can't you be pleased that someone has saved money? Are you so spiteful as to not want him to?

Unbelievable!

Quite so.

Meeper

HappyMJ wrote: »

Because he is listening to a sales technique that promises him savings where none exists. He is trusting you and you have no idea what tariff he is on yet you claim he will save money. The tariff he was on is the most expensive ScottishPower tariff possible. It cannot be any higher unless he has actively switched to include a Unifi device or to include gas boiler cover or to include a green fund contribution. You said he hasn't switched for 7+ years so he would not have done any of that.

How do you know what my "sales technique" is. Do you see any of the advisers in the videos you have seen about UW's sales technique discussing the costs in this much detail? No. You have no idea what I have told him, so don't deign to know what "sales techniques" I have used. I looked at his bills, looked at the usage numbers, and said what the cost would have been with UW. Not sure that comparing the numbers directly is much of a technique, to be honest.

Why can it not be higher? What was the tariff 7 years ago? Or 1,2,3,4,5 or 6 years ago? What was he on? Are you certain he was on Standard Tariff? How do you know? Is it impossible that he was on a tariff higher than the standard? I have been asked whether there was a possibility that the bills were wrong by Cardew. Yes, just as much chance of the bill being wrong as the actual tariff being wrong and leading him to be paying so much.

Why such resistance? You seem to want proof of stuff, I give you the proof, and still you persist.

It's not my fault he was paying an exorbitant amount before, blame SP, not me! I saved the guy money. You should be giving me a big pat on the back. He bought me a pint!

HappyMJ

Meeper wrote: »

Now, who's resorting to being personal?

Perhaps it is, and perhaps he should. But he didn't. Ergo, he has saved money by switching to UW.

Good try, but don't try to be smart and divert attention away from the facts here.

That's what was stated on his bill. There were no arrears, it was for a 12 month period.

I have posted details of the information on the bill already, we've been debating it all afternoon!

Why would you want to stay with a company who have been ripping you off for years? Sure, he could have found it slightly cheaper elsewhere, yet he didn't. I spoke to him and saved him hundreds of pounds per year. I haven't mentioned that he will also save an additional £132 per year off his phone & broadband package with BT (remember than from earlier....) and save money off his calls to his family in America and Australia. They are all ancillary savings, as are the savings he will make on the cashback card.

The guy is more than happy with the service I have given him and the savings he is making. Why can't you be pleased that someone has saved money? Are you so spiteful as to not want him to?

Quite so.

We are all happy for him to save money but I just cannot see the savings. To me he is now paying more than staying put. You have incorrect figures that I cannot figure out and as a financial advisor you should be advising him to claim back the excess from ScottishPower.

Why don't you give him a call and find out the tariff rates from his bill and any additons and deductions that were made?

The per unit rates are from ScottishPower's own tariff table. Is there a mistake in the tariff table and there is another hidden much more expensive tariff? I don't think so.