Kleeneeze or Betterware?

Lady_Python

There are a few people with "no leaflets etc." signs on the door.

I respect those people and will neither put a book in nor knock their door.

I have been caught by a neighbour in the past asking me to put a book in neighbour's door as she/he now wants one (probably having seen the neighbour's book). I ended up with a really good customer that way who bought out of nearly every book and was very disappointed when I gave up.

Ironically, for every house that has a "no sales" ticket on the door, there are a lot more who do want a book.

I try to respect peoples' wishes.

Honest_John_666

Crikey........lots of replies

OGF - I will try & get the number of the text I mentioned & call them myself

PRODUCTS - from what I've been told.......... BETTERWARE offers a NO QUIBBLE 12 months guarantee - yes the products can be bought cheaper - NO the cheap shops do not have a 12 month guarantee - Kleeneze DO NOT ALSO offer this guarantee - In fact......they are even worse than that..... Because they have no boundaries & no area managers any person that buys a product from an agent will really really struggle to get their money back. Obviously Pete is a good guy & would agree this does happen & it happens very often. The MAJOR differnece I can work out is with Betterware, is that if the agent leaves, there is always an Area Manager or a Regional manager there to sort out the problem......most of the time anyway!!!

FINDEL....... yes not confirmed BUT its looking grim again

Kleeneze...... yes a supposed profitable arm of Findel & if Findel went down the pan SOMEONE would buy them BUT this doesn't mean they will operate the same way

Andrew Cohen......yes he is Betterware's owner, Yes he did think about buying Kleeneze a few years ago, Yes it was to eliminate the competition, No it didn't make sense to me BUT he's a lot more successful than me so who am I to answer this one!!! I can make enquireries if you like???

Gavin Scott...... tells me he's a multi millionaire....also his E-mails are dreadful, quite threatening & as is they are written by a 5 year old. Tells me that there is something major coming out in Jan??? PETE did you go to Hong Kong Gavin sent me the video

Mass Dropping of books.......Betterware mass drop books until told to clear off. They should keep accurate records. The downside to this is if the agent changes, then they are told to re-canvass te complete area. If they have the same agent that covers the same area then there should be no problems. Kleeneze cant do this, thats why there is sooooo many horrors stories. Avon aren't 100% either because these Sales Leaders can recruit & put anyone anywhere, but most are very could

HAVE I MISSED ANYTHING????

Pete you sound like a great guy good luck to you my friend & keep posting!!! As for Gavin Scott, what a ****** he is!!!

Regards to all
Honest John
The seeker of Truth & Justice

Honest_John_666

This thread is turning into an anti Kleeneze thread again Betterware sell almost exactly the same stuff as us.[/QUOTE]



For me Pete as you know I am anti Kleeneze because of the various encounters I have has with them I believe the company is scum

As for the products...... again research shows me that approx 80% of goods in the Kleeneze catalogue are the MORE EXPENSIVE than Betterware

Would you like to confirm or disagree with this, this is from the main catalogue NOT sales flyers???

It is a simple choice whether you buy or not, I grant you.

Cheaper products with a no quibble 12 month guarantee, no start ups fees, No buying books, order forms, bags, DVD's, training aids, Exclusive territory no wars, bonuses, Now with guaranteed money (A Wage not just commision only), No charges to order the goods, no minimum order value, deliveries to you door at a definate time

.........well this isn't biased this is isn't anti-anyone this is A FACT

Regards
John

Peter_Pan

Honest_John_666 wrote: »

Crikey........lots of replies



FINDEL....... yes not confirmed BUT its looking grim again

Kleeneze...... yes a supposed profitable arm of Findel & if Findel went down the pan SOMEONE would buy them BUT this doesn't mean they will operate the same way

Andrew Cohen......yes he is Betterware's owner, Yes he did think about buying Kleeneze a few years ago, Yes it was to eliminate the competition, No it didn't make sense to me BUT he's a lot more successful than me so who am I to answer this one!!! I can make enquireries if you like???

Gavin Scott...... tells me he's a multi millionaire....also his E-mails are dreadful, quite threatening & as is they are written by a 5 year old. Tells me that there is something major coming out in Jan??? PETE did you go to Hong Kong Gavin sent me the video


HAVE I MISSED ANYTHING????

Pete you sound like a great guy good luck to you my friend & keep posting!!! As for Gavin Scott, what a ****** he is!!!

Regards to all
Honest John
The seeker of Truth & Justice

Why don't the big leaders in Kleeneze pool resources and take over Kleeneze themselves, they could then run it as they wanted?

Honest_John_666

Peter_Pan wrote: »

Why don't the big leaders in Kleeneze pool resources and take over Kleeneze themselves, they could then run it as they wanted?

Good point, not sure how much it would cost???

No one ever knows EXACTLY how much Kleenezes profit is, they say it turned over £65M, I think BUT this tells you nothing

I know that they were 4% above last years sales approx 6/8 months ago BUT this was based on 2 years of going backwards. NOT sure if Pete knows any more???

Gavin Scott according to the E-mail I had from him today (As Long as it was him writing to me) is a multi-millionaire SO your right.....If him & the others in the top 3 are earning that much & it's such a great company then why dont they buy it out.

Any other fantastic Kleeneze people care to join in???

Regards to all
John

Lady_Python

In an earlier post, someone said that people had been sold a lie.

It is based on a lie - the lie that agents can earn good money.

Not the case. When you add up the cost of books, fuel for the car getting from A to B, getting the books back undamaged if you're lucky, making them all up with the 101 leaflets that go in them, then often having to go several times to deliver to someone only to find they either weren't in or didn't have the money, it was a lot of work for very little return.

Then the killer. The poor quality of many goods. Not saying all the products were bad, indeed some were extremely good, but latterly when I did it, some of the products quite frankly, contravened the Trades Description Act and many were "not fit for purpose".

It was the rubbish products that cost us customers. So many times I felt, by selling Kleeneze, I was ripping people off. I got out of it after less than 2 years.

The only ones who made any money worth mentioning were the upline and beyond and they made their money off the backs of people like me, who walked street after street in all weathers.

Kleeneze is probably the most parasistical "business" there is.

I can't speak for Betterware because I haven't worked for them.

My advice to anyone thinking of joining Kleeneze is DON'T.

Honest_John_666

Lady_Python wrote: »

In an earlier post, someone said that people had been sold a lie.

It is based on a lie - the lie that agents can earn good money.

Not the case. When you add up the cost of books, fuel for the car getting from A to B, getting the books back undamaged if you're lucky, making them all up with the 101 leaflets that go in them, then often having to go several times to deliver to someone only to find they either weren't in or didn't have the money, it was a lot of work for very little return.

Then the killer. The poor quality of many goods. Not saying all the products were bad, indeed some were extremely good, but latterly when I did it, some of the products quite frankly, contravened the Trades Description Act and many were "not fit for purpose".

It was the rubbish products that cost us customers. So many times I felt, by selling Kleeneze, I was ripping people off. I got out of it after less than 2 years.

The only ones who made any money worth mentioning were the upline and beyond and they made their money off the backs of people like me, who walked street after street in all weathers.

Kleeneze is probably the most parasistical "business" there is.

I can't speak for Betterware because I haven't worked for them.

My advice to anyone thinking of joining Kleeneze is DON'T.

Great post Lady P :T & I take it you dont like them then??? :rotfl:

Can I pls ask you ........why did it take you 2 years to pull out of Kleeneze???

My mate works with Betterware & he laughs his socks off reading all these posts. He wont come on here but isn't it obvious reading back through this thread what a parasite most of them are.

Regards & best wishes LP
John

petestan

Honest_John_666 wrote: »

For me Pete as you know I am anti Kleeneze because of the various encounters I have has with them I believe the company is scum

As for the products...... again research shows me that approx 80% of goods in the Kleeneze catalogue are the MORE EXPENSIVE than Betterware

Would you like to confirm or disagree with this, this is from the main catalogue NOT sales flyers???

It is a simple choice whether you buy or not, I grant you.

Cheaper products with a no quibble 12 month guarantee, no start ups fees, No buying books, order forms, bags, DVD's, training aids, Exclusive territory no wars, bonuses, Now with guaranteed money (A Wage not just commision only), No charges to order the goods, no minimum order value, deliveries to you door at a definate time

.........well this isn't biased this is isn't anti-anyone this is A FACT

Regards
John

Hi John, I check prices between the two every now and again and they seem similarly priced to me, Kleeneze are more expensive on some items and Betterware are more expensive on others, I would put it more like 60 - 40 to Betterware. Having said that I don't think I have checked prices since our recent price rise.

As I have said previously I agree on the 12 months guarantee but what can I do about it, it's a pain having to send something back for Kleeneze to refund because it's been over 90 days and I can't refund the customer luckily it doesn't happen to often.

I suspect part of the reason for people being more upset about Kleeneze is the fact that there are no territories so someone may never see a book whereas someone else may see 2 or 3 a week from different distributors and they may never see a Betterware book.

The sticker idea posted by bloosom is a good idea but it would have to be a new one saying "No catalogues wanted" or something as loads of my customers have the "no doorstep sellers" sticker on their door / window at present but obviously they want a kleeneze cat.

As for gavin scott I don't think he is a multi millionaire but I have no idea, I think generally what he says in his emails is he earns what a multi millionaire would earn on interest in the bank and has the lifestyle of one if you know what I mean, it's hard to explain. He used to be a shipyard Blacksmith so I would say he is probably not very good at explaining things that well.

No I didn't go to Hong Kong that is the 1st company one Gavin has been on in a while I think, but I'm not sure.

The suggestion that the top earners should all pool together and buy out Kleeneze, well like everyone else, except bigger, they all have big houses, holiday homes abroad, fancy holidays and numerous cars, horses, etc. so I suspect they wouldn't be able to even if Findel wanted to sell and anyway they would probably want to alter the system to make themselves more money which would probably mean the lower people would lose out and leave. They are probably happy with it as it is now they get their monthly cheques for thousands of pounds and don't owe the banks millions.

Kleeneze's operating profit was £6.3 million to April 2010.

http://www.findel.co.uk/wps/wcm/connect/e642b3004359bddbbee6be2ab1bb6a02/Findel+plc+Preliminary+Results+2010+FINAL+20-07-10.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=e642b3004359bddbbee6be2ab1bb6a02


Cheers, Pete.

Lady_Python

Honest_John_666 wrote: »

Great post Lady P :T & I take it you dont like them then??? :rotfl:

Can I pls ask you ........why did it take you 2 years to pull out of Kleeneze???

My mate works with Betterware & he laughs his socks off reading all these posts. He wont come on here but isn't it obvious reading back through this thread what a parasite most of them are.

Regards & best wishes LP
John

Good question. Why indeed nearly 2 years.

Every time I voiced concerns to the upline, I got told to put out more books, cover more streets - all, of course, paid for out of my pocket with extra books etc. which as any Kleeneze agent knows, the books are not cheap.

I was made to feel it was MY fault that Kleeneze wasn't working.

I ended up running at a loss, it put a strain on my marriage and the only ones benefitting from the whole thing were the upline.

Even when Kleeneze were in dire straights and the memo was on their agent's site for all to see, the upline still lied by saying there was nothing to worry about - then the Farepak bubble burst and the rest is history.

As far as I know, the upline are still doing it and still suckering people into this glorified scam.

You bet I hate Kleeneze. I have every cause to and so do many others caught out by this lie.

I've started doing Avon now because at my age, despite many years experience, I find I can't get a normal job. The difference this time is no-one has said I will earn loads of money. No false promises - and it's a product I've been using myself for over 30 years.

I would like to build it up but I'm not expecting great things. It gives me something to do. I am not cut out to be a stay at home wife - at least a few weeks is fine, but boredom was setting in and I had to find something to do.

Perhaps the hardest part of doing Avon is not buying everything I like.

I...must...desist...LOL

Peter_Pan

Lady_Python wrote: »

In an earlier post, someone said that people had been sold a lie.

It is based on a lie - the lie that agents can earn good money.
Depends what you class as good money, an extra £50 a week is achievable after building a customer base (we did it) which can can make a huge difference to a familys income.

Not the case. When you add up the cost of books, fuel for the car getting from A to B, getting the books back undamaged if you're lucky, making them all up with the 101 leaflets that go in them, then often having to go several times to deliver to someone only to find they either weren't in or didn't have the money, it was a lot of work for very little return.
Agree to a certain extent that you do have expenses to take into consideration but it can provide extra cash flowing through a household which again can make a huge difference even after expenses. Any Business is initially a lot of work for little return but after finding the customers we found it does get easier and more rewarding and no i don't do Kleeneze anymore.

Then the killer. The poor quality of many goods. Not saying all the products were bad, indeed some were extremely good, but latterly when I did it, some of the products quite frankly, contravened the Trades Description Act and many were "not fit for purpose".
Agree 100% on this, it was one of many reasons we quit, i was ashamed of the quality of some of the products.

It was the rubbish products that cost us customers. So many times I felt, by selling Kleeneze, I was ripping people off. I got out of it after less than 2 years.
Same here

I have to want to order the products myself before i can give my heart and soul to a Business and with Kleeneze i couldn't, i do still think though that if people are prepared to work the brochures for at least 6-9 months you can build a good customer base and that should bring in an extra £50 per week minus the expenses of course but from a Business point of view i think its been flogged too much now and because of poor upline support in cases and lack of training and false expectations it has lost its reputation and as being successful is based on recruiting people and helping them be successful its past its prime now in my opinion.