Kleeneeze or Betterware?

Honest_John_666

Also update regarding my last post about my mum's area co-ordinator, I had shown my mum the post from Wongawonga and she had called up Betterware asking about it.
Betterware had a few complaints (by a few, I mean around 25) for the same area co-ordinator.

Betterware had done a investigation with the police. It turned out he was claiming benefits while earning with Betterware plus his bank had noticed that all of the money from Betterware and Jobseekers went straight into his savings account. He made a lot of money from the savings. I think my mum said it was £500 per month on interest alone. My mum had said that Betterware said it had taken place roughly a year my mum left Betterware.

Luckily the guy doesn't work for Betterware anymore but unforunately my mum never got any of that interest but my mum said it was a good result but would have been better if she got some money off him lol.[/QUOTE]


WHAT A LOAD OF RUBBISH :mad:

(Text removed by MSE Forum Team) YOU DO HAVE A VERY GOOD IMAGINATION

THEY WOULD GIVE YOU THAT INFO YESTERDAY ABOUT YOUR MUM FROM YEARS AGO YEAH OF COURSE THEY WOULD

ANYONE ELSE GOING TO CALL BETTERWARE UP

Honest_John_666

Its great to be back in the old UK :j

Back to the BIG BAD UK WORLD & all those lovely Kleeneze reps earning £1000's per week, enjoying 5 Star luxury holidays, never a better time to join garbage, recruiting like mad, as easy as anything, all those KLZ TV ads, those online sales, those smaller books, those costs they dont tell you about.........:D

Just got off the old dog to my old mate & asked him to look in at the site, they said they'll call me back later

Whilst chewing the fat he told me that Betterware NOW can offer an EMPLOYED position along the same lines of just delivering & collecting books. WOW Guaranteed money weekly, plus bonues. It is a full time ish role BUT gauranteed money & pretty much your own boss.

OPPPPSSSSSSSSSSS AM I RECRUITING.............SORRY

Honest_John_666

8) I did work for Betterware a while ago (sort of). My mom was doing betterware about 13 years ago and I helped around when she was in hospital. We did do about 50-50. So I think I'm giving a unbiased opinion.

Like I said both companies have advantages over each other. I like both companies but in my opinion I think Kleeneze wins by a margin. The only reason I think Kleeneze wins is when I did betterware, we was given an area which was basically 10 streets. We had about 20 orders equalling under £150 in each drop. However kleeneze you weren't given an area but we did the same area and got about £400 each time.

CUCKOO :rotfl:

freedoms_2

I think it's important to set the record straight here about the differences between some of the outfits mentioned.

Kleeneze is a pyramid, and an MLM - they are virtually synonyms, and both illegal in the UK.
"If it's illegal, why hasn't it been shut down?"
Kleeneze, and a few other MLM scams were been shut down by the OFT, many years ago. They currently operate illegally. The shutdown notice consists of a letter politely asking them if they'd mind not doing that particular thing. It was designed to be sent out to banks and other organisations that (should) know what they're doing.

Avon is weird: It was originally legal, in America, then came over here, at which point it became illegal, because MLM is legal in the USA but not the UK. They actually sat up and took notice when they got shut down, and worked very hard to become legal. Most companies slide the other way. Recently (2011-2013), they're showing disturbing signs of falling back into MLM practices. I currently rate them as borderline.

Betterware is the largest direct sales company in the UK by a good margin, and also the only one of any significant size operating legally, as an employer and a privately limited company. With them, you are not self-employed.
They have four levels, for purpose of comparison with the MLMs:

Distributor, earning 20% commission, but probably never enough to pay tax or earn bonuses.
Typical PT weekly earnings £40, FT £80, double that at xmas.
All stationary, catalogues, and everything else (within reason) that you need to do the job are free.
There is no joining fee.
If you have to make a refund, you are legally obliged to inform the customer of alternative options
(replacement of product, which you don't pay for, and refund of payment, which you lose 20% on).

Area Coordinator, earning £200/wk plus 10% comm on sales by their distributors. They also have to support their subordinates with bulk deliveries and weekly meetings.

Regional Manager, of which there are 12, earning £800/wk. They have to manage traffic in their local area, look after their subordinates, and help head office also.

Head Office, of which there is one, earning presumably everything left over.
Lots of people work there, all on varying fixed rates, all above NMW.
Jobs include picking & packing, accounts, procurement, catalogue design, and executive management.
Printing is contracted out, to maximise warehouse space.

Betterware has sales territories partly based on postcode areas, and recruitment is partially managed centrally. If there are no vacancies in an area, you may apply to another area or you are placed in a queue. Because it's below the NMW for distributors, people tend to use it as a temporary job when they can't get any other work, so the turnover rate at the bottom is fairly high. FT Workers tend to stay much longer.

If you live in a high crime or violent area, it's very difficult to remain in the job; this applies to most other types of job too though.


I have worked for Betterware three times:
1998, for about a year, ended by violent crime in the area.
2004, for about a year, starting in one town the transferring to a town that was new for them, including setting up a depot, which is non-standard behaviour for a distributor. That was ended by extreme violent crime committed by Swindon police; this was related to my Landlady, (despite her operating legally,) and was not related to Betterware itself. I told them to go and bother Farepak (then called Kleenze Europe), two years before they blew up. The police ignored my advice.
2006-7, for about a year, ended by being (illegally) fined (sanctioned) by the DWP for refusing to declare as self-employed, despite not being self-employed and declaring as PT employed.


I have never worked for Kleeneze. They tried to sue me in 2007, and they lost. Due to this, they can never sue me again. I also intercepted internal communications of them discussing having me professionally beaten up, and then chickening out.
I have never worked for Avon, but I have supplied services to them, unless they fully slip back into MLM.
I have worked for Betterware three times in the past, with low PT earnings, declared on a B7 whilst also claiming JSA. The third time, this resulted
in enforcement action by the DWP, which I took direct political action back against, and won.
I was a member of the Unfairpak forum. I was also kicked out of the forum when they were infiltrated by Kleeneze.
I have had some direct communication with the Betterware MD and the Findel CEO, as well as some departments and ministers of the government.
I am currently self-employed, and work in advertising at a very modest profit. I do not currently claim benefits, although my food is provided
by charity from relatives, which is wholly supported by financial advice I gave them circa 2002.

In September 2012, the HMRC announced a crackdown on direct sales companies including Kleeneze.
This may or may not have had something to do with me.

freedoms_2

I ought to add that Betterware areas (for distributors) are usually not less than 100 streets, and take six weeks to get around. If you do it faster or slower, your area size is adjusted. Sometimes you cover for other people, if they fall ill or go on holiday. I don't think they pay holiday pay, but I never took a holiday while working for them.

freedoms_2

(Reads back further...)
I also should add that neither coordinators nor any other employees pay VAT. That's the company's job. Everyone except distributors pay PAYE. Because it's below NMW, distributors escape this, presumably unless they complete a tax return, in which case they'd declare directly, I imagine. I never heard of distributors earning enough to pay any tax, and the boundaries are quite high.

wongawonga

freedoms wrote: »

Everyone except distributors pay PAYE. Because it's below NMW, distributors escape this, presumably unless they complete a tax return.

Most Distributors dont pay paye tax because they are self employed.But are still required to declare it and pay tax if appropriate.

"Am I self-employed or do I work for Betterware?

You will be self employed."

http://jobs.betterware.co.uk/faqs/

However as Honest John mentions they do have some paid distributor posts, and they are also trialling the Kleeneze MLM approach where distributors can recruit and earn from there team.

Further more neither Avon or Kleeneze are illegal they are legal direct selling /networking marketing companies. Love or hate them they are not and never have been pyramid schemes.As neither offer payment or services, primarily for enrolling other people into the business.

AJB135

Does anyone know the initial cost becoming a Kleeneze distributor . Is it worth signing up for it .

Many Thanks

wongawonga

AJB135 wrote: »

Does anyone know the initial cost becoming a Kleeneze distributor . Is it worth signing up for it .

Many Thanks

Start up costs vary depending on amount of money you wish to invest in joining .

Google is a wonderful thing = http://www.kleeneze.co.uk/ and ask for info,or ask your local rep i guess their bite your hand off.


Have you read any of the thread what do you think ? about signing up.Think you could be more successful then the many who have quit.

Honest_John_666

AJB135 wrote: »

Does anyone know the initial cost becoming a Kleeneze distributor . Is it worth signing up for it .

Many Thanks

Read through thread

Honest answer is swerve Kleeneze like the plague :beer: