Over Insured.........CARDIF PINNACLE

marshallka

Just a heads up to anyone that has a works policy of Group Income Protection insurance. We have been paying for an income protection policy with Pinnacle since 2004 to provide income for us should my husband become sick, have an accident or become unemployed.

We never realised that we could not claim on both this and our group income protection cover which provides the maximum 75% of income should my husband become sick or have an accident.

This means that although it was a standalone policy we have actually been over insured on that part.

We have emailed Pinnacle about it and they have asked for all proofs of our works Income Protection (which we have now provided TWICE!!!) as they DID say they would definately refund after looking at the most recent one and they stated that it was definately duplicated and had been passed by their manager. Only time will tell if they do honour this but up to yet things are looking good.

Just wanted to post in case anyone else has taken out a standalone policy for income protection that they could actually never use.

maxdp

Would that be the same if you had PPI on CC or Loans as well as the Group Income Protection Insurance Marshallka. Would you be unable to claim on the CC at the same time?

Hope this pays out quickly for you Marshallka.

robbedofmymoney

maxdp wrote: »

Would that be the same if you had PPI on CC or Loans as well as the Group Income Protection Insurance Marshallka. Would you be unable to claim on the CC at the same time?

Hope this pays out quickly for you Marshallka.

you may find its in the small print of the insurance policy where it says the policy will pay out if you are unable to afford your monthly re-payments due to a loss of income.

as your income protection would kick in the CC ppi may not pay out on top of your income protection as they could say that you can still afford your minimum repayments as your income has not significantly reduced.

hope this helps. this is one of the arguements i have with Lloyds, and they will not say that their LPI would pay out in addition to my income protection, Only dodge the question.

the way it works is that the money you can claim from insurers is limited to a percentage of your gross earnings to prevent you from getting more than you earn, so effectively if you have a policy for 75% of your gross earnings the chances are an additional policy will not pay out.

banks know this and still sell policies to us knowing we are already insured

marshallka

maxdp wrote: »

Would that be the same if you had PPI on CC or Loans as well as the Group Income Protection Insurance Marshallka. Would you be unable to claim on the CC at the same time?

Hope this pays out quickly for you Marshallka.

I think some pay out a seperate mortgage protection and also your income protection if they both add up to 75% but ours was actually 75% of income we are protected for so they have said that this actually duplicate for sickness and accident. I don't know how it would work with PPI though as all the PP
I's we paid (single premiums) we got back and also they were "joint" loans. We never had any CC PPI on any of our cards.

Also the works one would pay out indefinately (right up to retirement) if the worst should happen but the other only pays out for 12 months maximum.

maxdp

I think that the Pinnacle type thing is to protect your income the CC and Loan PPI is to cover those payments so I wonder if they actually pay out as well. Do not know perhaps Dunsonh can answer this.

marshallka

maxdp wrote: »

I think that the Pinnacle type thing is to protect your income the CC and Loan PPI is to cover those payments so I wonder if they actually pay out as well. Do not know perhaps Dunsonh can answer this.

I don't think they would TBH maxdp but cannot be sure. Ours is just two income protection policies actually attached to nothing. Do credit cards etc ask for details of income whilst you are ill etc? I suppose if they did pay out also it would make some people (if they had a lot of debt on cards and loans) actually better off not working and being ill? I would think they would take income coming in into account as to whether they would pay out also.

maxdp

robbedofmymoney wrote: »

you may find its in the small print of the insurance policy where it says the policy will pay out if you are unable to afford your monthly re-payments due to a loss of income.

as your income protection would kick in the CC ppi may not pay out on top of your income protection as they could say that you can still afford your minimum repayments as your income has not significantly reduced.

hope this helps. this is one of the arguements i have with Lloyds, and they will not say that their LPI would pay out in addition to my income protection, Only dodge the question.

the way it works is that the money you can claim from insurers is limited to a percentage of your gross earnings to prevent you from getting more than you earn, so effectively if you have a policy for 75% of your gross earnings the chances are an additional policy will not pay out.

banks know this and still sell policies to us knowing we are already insured

OK i see what you mean here. I just knew that PPI on cards and loans only pay as a minimum the monthly payment but the other one is an income protection. But I also see about he 75%.:)

marshallka

Well bad news. Although they have said they would refund they have now changed their minds and are saying that theirs kicks in 60 days after being ill and the works one kicks in 6 months after. I have stated that work pay for 6 months and they are not interested. May now take this to FOS as I know for definate that we could not claim on the two but they are saying that we could claim on theirs after 60 days so really their policy is only good for 4 months IF they would pay out as well as our wages and have asked this question to them now. I know that they would not pay whilst we are still getting wages but they have managed to wriggle out of it. Our works one pays the maximum we are allowed (75%) so when works one kicks in theirs would definately not be claimable also and also the wages sick pay issue. Have nothing to lose really taking this to FOS have I lol.

It was too good to be true on this as I first thought and never count your chickens as they say. Pinnacle are a load of tosh.

marshallka

They have now replied with this about the works policy and not even mentioned about the full pay for the first six months so I am assuming that they are saying that their policy WOULD pay out also along with our full pay as asked????? I find this bad advice if they are stating that this is actually in our interests for us to carry on paying for this and if they are saying that this is not ideal then it has NEVER been ideal also.


Dear

Thank you for your recent e-mail.

I can confirm that may be able to claim on both policies however the
benefit payable may be reduced by Friends Provident to ensure that you are
not receiving more than 75% of your income, this would increase again after
your claim with us stopped.

If you have any further queries, please do not hesitate to contact me.



I really cannot believe this. They are saying that we would be able to claim on their policy (which would mean them paying AS WELL as our wages for first first 4 months - yeah right (if my husband was ill ect for long term) and then they would reduce the "WORKS" policy by the amount we are claiming from them. What is the point???? Paying for another policy that reduces the works policy by the amount when the works one would pay the full amount of 75% maximum insurance????

Could the above be classed of bad advice? I think so as they are still saying that after writing to them and explaining our situation to them that having their policy is actually a good thing and in our interest????

marshallka

I am doing my nut now with this person who is dealing with my complaint at Pinnacle. He will not answer my question as to whether THEIR policy will pay out even when we are getting full pay for 6 months and just keeps on saying that their policy would pay out after 60 days and that when the works one kicks in after 6 months the works one would then be reduced by the amount we have insured with pinnacle.

I am totally annoyed and very frustrated at the moment TBH about their dealing with this. WHen it was passed to a manager (who authorised the refund was definately due) it was all going along smoothly and then this !!!!!! got hold of it and its totally a mess. I have quoted treating customers fairly and also done a hard copy of all emails and a proper complaints letter to them (which I should have done before i know!!). I think it will have to go to FOS in the end and then it will be the usual wait but I have stated to Pinnacle that should it go to FOS and I win I would then be entitled to 8% statutory interest on top. I still cannot see them giving in even though we are over insured.

Copy of another email from the !!!!!! who is dealing with it now


Dear ,

Thank you for your recent e-mail.

I can confirm that this policy would pay out after you have been off for a
minimum of 60 days if you have a successful claim for Accident, Sickness,
Unemployment or Carer's Cover. Once you are eligible to claim on your
employer's group policy after 6 months they should reduce the benefit that
they pay by the amount we are paying to ensure that you are not over
insured. Once we have paid the full 12 months benefit you will be entitled
to claim the full benefit from the policy with friends provident. Your
policy with the employers would then pay until you reach retirement age or
return to work as stated in the policy document.

If you have any further queries, please do not hesitate to contact me.


Yours Sincerely,

BUT WHAT ABOUT US GETTING PAID FROM WORK FOR THE FIRST 6 MONTHS???????????????????????????????

If it pays out alongside his wages then whoopee, we have been paying it for a maximum cover of 4 months cover as we have the other policy 75% claimable after 6 months. He just cannot see where I am coming from. Had we have known that the two do not pay together without anything being reduced then we would never have taken it out.

robbedofmymoney

marshallka wrote: »

I am doing my nut now with this person who is dealing with my complaint at Pinnacle. He will not answer my question as to whether THEIR policy will pay out even when we are getting full pay for 6 months and just keeps on saying that their policy would pay out after 60 days and that when the works one kicks in after 6 months the works one would then be reduced by the amount we have insured with pinnacle.

I am totally annoyed and very frustrated at the moment TBH about their dealing with this. WHen it was passed to a manager (who authorised the refund was definately due) it was all going along smoothly and then this !!!!!! got hold of it and its totally a mess. I have quoted treating customers fairly and also done a hard copy of all emails and a proper complaints letter to them (which I should have done before i know!!). I think it will have to go to FOS in the end and then it will be the usual wait but I have stated to Pinnacle that should it go to FOS and I win I would then be entitled to 8% statutory interest on top. I still cannot see them giving in even though we are over insured.

Copy of another email from the !!!!!! who is dealing with it now


Dear ,

Thank you for your recent e-mail.

I can confirm that this policy would pay out after you have been off for a
minimum of 60 days if you have a successful claim for Accident, Sickness,
Unemployment or Carer's Cover. Once you are eligible to claim on your
employer's group policy after 6 months they should reduce the benefit that
they pay by the amount we are paying to ensure that you are not over
insured. Once we have paid the full 12 months benefit you will be entitled
to claim the full benefit from the policy with friends provident. Your
policy with the employers would then pay until you reach retirement age or
return to work as stated in the policy document.

If you have any further queries, please do not hesitate to contact me.


Yours Sincerely,

BUT WHAT ABOUT US GETTING PAID FROM WORK FOR THE FIRST 6 MONTHS???????????????????????????????

If it pays out alongside his wages then whoopee, we have been paying it for a maximum cover of 4 months cover as we have the other policy 75% claimable after 6 months. He just cannot see where I am coming from. Had we have known that the two do not pay together without anything being reduced then we would never have taken it out.

i agree e is a !!!!!!, he is carefully wording his e-mails saying you would be entitled to a claim if you become eligable. i think we all know you would not be eligable if you are still getting full pay. he is deliberately avoiding this issue for a reason.

personally i would persevere with this as you will not benifit from the policy