Incapacity Benefit Wrongly Stopped - Failed Medical

strawberry_cupcake_2

healy wrote: »

That is up to you. I could tell how I know but that would still not provide any evidence as it is only my word which you already appear not to believe.

I have experience of a very large number of tribunals and they have always been independent, if you had problems with yours and you felt it was not independent you could/should have taken it further.

so you keep on saying, but I know how mine went, and I know that questions that the judge asked me, didn't appear on the score sheet, and how leading questions were asked with no leaway to explain things etc, yes I could take it further, but what is the point? I know that in my heart I am correct and i know that vital info was left off my score sheet, but its my word against theirs, and I cannot put myself through the stress of it all again, so its best to just admit defeat, I am certain that one day ATOS will be exposed for what they are, and then I will have the last laugh.

I worked from the day I left school, I have worked in local government my entire working life, I got ill, it resulted in me leaving a job I adored, yes adored, and if I was well enough I would be back behind my desk in a heartbeat, but alas I am not.

I know what happened to me, I was indeed chucked on the scrap heap, cant sign on for JSA (as I am unfit for work) can't receive IB or whatever name it goes by these days, so on paper, I dont exist.

healy

strawberry_cupcake wrote: »

so you keep on saying, but I know how mine went, and I know that questions that the judge asked me, didn't appear on the score sheet, and how leading questions were asked with no leaway to explain things etc, yes I could take it further, but what is the point? I know that in my heart I am correct and i know that vital info was left off my score sheet, but its my word against theirs, and I cannot put myself through the stress of it all again, so its best to just admit defeat, I am certain that one day ATOS will be exposed for what they are, and then I will have the last laugh.

I worked from the day I left school, I have worked in local government my entire working life, I got ill, it resulted in me leaving a job I adored, yes adored, and if I was well enough I would be back behind my desk in a heartbeat, but alas I am not.

I know what happened to me, I was indeed chucked on the scrap heap, cant sign on for JSA (as I am unfit for work) can't receive IB or whatever name it goes by these days, so on paper, I dont exist.

The point of taking it further would have been to have the decision corrected and receive the benefit, but it sounds like you do not need the money so that is your decsion.

Obviously things can and do go wrong but yours is just one case, the vast majority have a fair appeal and as I said if they do not have a fair appeal it can be rectified.

nogginthenog

cit_k wrote: »

There is no law that stops a recording being used as evidence in a ESA appeal that I know of, unless you know of something specifically stopping it, in which case could you share the data.

Its up to the tribunal to decide what evidence to accept, and tribunals can accept taped evidence if they wish. Especially if you tell then about a past case where it was ruled acceptable.

4.1.3 Audio and video taping of examinations

Should a claimant attend the assessment requesting permission to either audio
or videotape the medical assessment you should politely refuse on the following
grounds:
The Department for Work and Pensions never requires that a medical
assessment for the purpose of advising on entitlement to state sickness or
disability benefits be recorded on audio or videotape.

Medical Services

ESA Handbook 1 Final
MED-ESAHB~001 Page 119

Such a claimant request can only be agreed with the prior consent of the
examining practitioner, and then only if stringent safeguards are in place to
ensure that the recording is complete, accurate, and that the facility is available
for simultaneous copies to be made available to all parties present. The
recording must be made by a professional operator, on equipment of a high
standard, properly calibrated by a qualified engineer immediately prior to the
recording being made.
The equipment must have facility for reproduction so that a copy of the tape can
be retained by all parties
The responsibility for meeting the cost of the above requirement rests with the
claimant.
Any request by a claimant for an assessment to be audio or videotaped must be
declined unless the above safeguards are in place. The claimant must instead
be offered the opportunity of a rescheduled assessment in the presence of a
companion or other witness. If the claimant refuses to avail him/her self of this
opportunity and refuses to proceed with the assessment, the practitioner should
return the file to the Department for Work and Pensions with a note explaining the
situation.

Unauthorised taping

It is for Atos Healthcare, in conjunction with their legal advisers, to determine the
action to be taken in the event of a claimant making an audio or video recording
without the prior knowledge and consent of the examining practitioner, or without
ensuring that the safeguards defined above are in place.

4.1.4 Taking of Notes during an Examination by Claimant or Companion

From time to time you may encounter a situation where the claimant is
accompanied by a companion and either the claimant or companion may wish to
take notes during the assessment.
Persons who are entitled to be in attendance are always entitled to take notes.
This is because it is for their own purposes and not an official record of the
process.

To attempt to deny the right to do so is likely to be contrary to Human Rights
legislation.

To request a copy of the notes is unlikely to be helpful – it will place you in the
position where you will be obliged to review the notes and comment on their
reliability. However, you should record in the medical report, the fact that notes
were being taken. The following warning should also be given and the fact
documented in the report. LiMA will offer the phrases as an optional addition.
For any handwritten report, on the rare occasions when this is necessary, the
report should be annotated on the front cover.

Medical Services

ESA Handbook 1 Final
MED-ESAHB~001 Page 120

The

nogginthenog

cit_k wrote: »

There is no law that stops a recording being used as evidence in a ESA appeal that I know of, unless you know of something specifically stopping it, in which case could you share the data.

Its up to the tribunal to decide what evidence to accept, and tribunals can accept taped evidence if they wish. Especially if you tell then about a past case where it was ruled acceptable.

IS'T that what i said anyway.

strawberry_cupcake_2

healy wrote: »

The point of taking it further would have been to have the decision corrected and receive the benefit, but it sounds like you do not need the money so that is your decsion.

Obviously things can and do go wrong but yours is just one case, the vast majority have a fair appeal and as I said if they do not have a fair appeal it can be rectified.

Dont need the money! I really do need the money, I wont even attempt to explain what our situation is financially now, but as I have previously said, the stress of the tribunal, the way the judge spoke to me, and the complete nightmare that I have endured since getting assessed by that ATOS clown has completely taken its toll and I dont have the strength to carry on, I am broken, and to add to the mix, my husband has now had a nervous breakdown brought on by what has happened, so another "victim" of this whole rotten business.

Thats why i wont try appealing, please, please, please dont patronise me by telling me how fair these people are, I know what happened and I know how our lives have been ruined by it.

cit_k

nogginthenog wrote: »

IS'T that what i said anyway.

Not exactly, you stated

"But a recording will NOT be allowed as evidence in ESA appeal.

Now to confuse things, if you take the appeal process a step further and go for a judicial review,...Taped evidence MAY be allowed if the judge permits and he/she thinks its of relivance to the case."

As far as I know, there is absolutely nothing stopping a claimaint using taped evidence in a ESA appeal other than it is at the discretion of the tribunal. (yes, you can also use it at the review of an appeal should it be required, again at their discretion)

The dwp rules you quoted only apply to medicals taped in accordance with their rules, most, if not all, cases involving a claimaint would have to involve covertly recorded evidence, as the rules are designed to price a claimaint out of justice,meaning they have record covertly.

cit_k

strawberry_cupcake wrote: »

Dont need the money! I really do need the money, I wont even attempt to explain what our situation is financially now, but as I have previously said, the stress of the tribunal, the way the judge spoke to me, and the complete nightmare that I have endured since getting assessed by that ATOS clown has completely taken its toll and I dont have the strength to carry on, I am broken, and to add to the mix, my husband has now had a nervous breakdown brought on by what has happened, so another "victim" of this whole rotten business.

Thats why i wont try appealing, please, please, please dont patronise me by telling me how fair these people are, I know what happened and I know how our lives have been ruined by it.

The dwp themselves admit, that under the new esa system many people will end up leaving the benefits system entirely, and only SOME into work, ie many people will be in your position who dont appeal - they know a 'significant' number of people will fall into that category, its in their ESA impact assessment.

Cold blooded of them or what, but its fact...

I think the system is designed to put people of appealing, by dragging the process out, giving a lack of information etc, making everything harder than it should be - when you fail a IB exam, you get thrown to the wolves...

healy

strawberry_cupcake wrote: »

Dont need the money! I really do need the money, I wont even attempt to explain what our situation is financially now, but as I have previously said, the stress of the tribunal, the way the judge spoke to me, and the complete nightmare that I have endured since getting assessed by that ATOS clown has completely taken its toll and I dont have the strength to carry on, I am broken, and to add to the mix, my husband has now had a nervous breakdown brought on by what has happened, so another "victim" of this whole rotten business.

Thats why i wont try appealing, please, please, please dont patronise me by telling me how fair these people are, I know what happened and I know how our lives have been ruined by it.

Surely if you did need the money you should have taken it further.

I am not patronising you just saying that the tribunal is in the vast majority of cases fair and that you could have done something about it. It is up to you if you did not. You are just one person it does not mean that everyone encounters problems because they do not.

Garry_Anderson

strawberry_cupcake wrote: »

Dont need the money! I really do need the money, I wont even attempt to explain what our situation is financially now, but as I have previously said, the stress of the tribunal, the way the judge spoke to me, and the complete nightmare that I have endured since getting assessed by that ATOS clown has completely taken its toll and I dont have the strength to carry on, I am broken, and to add to the mix, my husband has now had a nervous breakdown brought on by what has happened, so another "victim" of this whole rotten business.

Thats why i wont try appealing, please, please, please dont patronise me by telling me how fair these people are, I know what happened and I know how our lives have been ruined by it.

Dear SC - some people will never understand how stressful the procedure is for a sick person who has enough problems dealing with their health, let alone fighting authorities that treat them worse than criminals.

I hope your health problems get better over time

nogginthenog

cit_k wrote: »

Not exactly, you stated



As far as I know, there is absolutely nothing stopping a claimaint using taped evidence in a ESA appeal other than it is at the discretion of the tribunal. (yes, you can also use it at the review of an appeal should it be required, again at their discretion)

The dwp rules you quoted only apply to medicals taped in accordance with their rules, most, if not all, cases involving a claimaint would have to involve covertly recorded evidence, as the rules are designed to price a claimaint out of justice,meaning they have record covertly.

Can you show a benchmark case that it has been used in the past.(at a ESA appeal)
as far as i know they will not accept it...in that case there is something stopping you!
I accept your sentements regarding taped evidence.....But i doubt if a single reel,unsealed taped machine recording would ever be used, or accepted by the DWP as evidence...unless of course you are lucky enough to get a very generous and liberal judge..even then the dwp might appeal.