Crunch time for council workers’ golden pensions

bendix

lemonjelly wrote: »

Cogent arguements have been put forward, & sidestepped & not answered by blinkered individuals who have an overwhelming sense of self-importance.

Really? I must have missed them. Instead I've seen a lot of whining about how poorly paid people are in the public sector by those very same people who are in those jobs and who have complete freedom to get out of those jobs if they had the will and - here's the crux - the gumption to do so.

But it's better to be a victim and complain, isn it, rather than taking steps to improve it? It's more in tune with modern Britain.

movingforward2010

bendix wrote: »

If you come on this board snivelling and complaining that the so-called DM readers won't let your get your argument in, you need to have a good word with yourself.

If you have a cogent argument, let's hear it, instead of bleating that you're getting beaten up.

We put valid points across, but the only response made by individuals like yourself is that were all moaning, complaining, not taking responsibility blah blah blah.

' If you have a cogent argument, let's hear it, instead of bleating that you're getting beaten up'

Its quite obvious you only read what you want to :rolleyes: go back over the threads of the past few days to see for yourself, many a valid argument has been put forward but only to be shot down in flames.

bendix

wxmlad wrote: »

We put valid points across, but the only response made by individuals like yourself is that were all moaning, complaining, not taking responsibility blah blah blah.

' If you have a cogent argument, let's hear it, instead of bleating that you're getting beaten up'

Its quite obvious you only read what you want to :rolleyes: go back over the threads of the past few days to see for yourself, many a valid argument has been put forward but only to be shot down in flames.

With the greatest of respect, you yourself stated in an early post that you were only doing the public sector stuff to make money while you studied (very admirable, by the way).

So do you see it as a good place to work, and a viable long term career option. If so, why? If not, why not?

I'm genuinely interested.

The_White_Horse

baileysbattlebus wrote: »

Well regardless of whether you think the UK is bankrupt or not - you still need a public sector - Doctors, nurses, teachers, policemen, firemen, prison officers, carers for the elderly etc - the public sector includes a lot of occupations that many (maybe not you) would consider essential services.

How would you run essential services without a public sector or would just privatise the lot? I am interested. Or is it just some parts of the public sector you don't like?

People at the moment seem to be quite happy to buy our debt - I suppose we may have to worry when they stop. The last time I looked we weren't called Argentina.

Prisons are a case in point. Instead of giving scumbag criminals three hot meals a day and a cell, carpet in the corridors, a gym, games room, pool, hair salon (yes, this is true), libraries, parties, bingo evenings and god only knows what else, why don't they:

throw prisoners into cells with no furniture, bed clothes, sink, toilet etc. think of the savings on buying, washing, employees to do this. Never let the scum out of the cell, and feed them vitamin pills (simply to reduce medical bills) and bread and water. light bulbs are also unecessary - in the day they can see, in the night they can sleep. no exercise, television, music, books (which decent people have to PAY for).

Think how much more room there would be in prisons. How the violence would be reduced.b How the COST would be reduced. And how criminals would be punished for their crime and possibly deterred from reoffending.

The lefty in charge of the prison "service" once referred to the scum prisoners as her "clients". says it all really.

donaldtramp

The caring profession eh?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8223710.stm

Basic care 'lacking' in hospitals




Ron Kirk: 'We became horrified by the standard of nursing'

A patient lobby group is demanding an urgent review of basic hospital care after highlighting accounts of "appalling" NHS standards.

The Patients Association highlighted 16 cases in England where people, often the elderly, were left lying in faeces and urine and were not helped to eat.
The group's president Claire Rayner, an ex-nurse, called for "bad, cruel nurses" to be struck off

Only in the public sector would this be able to happen. No responsibility, no firing of inadequate staff.
People use Goodwin as an example of private sector/banking greed.
Here's an example of our wonderful NHS system.

SuzieSue

donaldtramp wrote: »

The caring profession eh?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8223710.stm



Only in the public sector would this be able to happen. No responsibility, no firing of inadequate staff.
People use Goodwin as an example of private sector/banking greed.
Here's an example of our wonderful NHS system.

The main reason for this is that the money is not being spent properly - it is being wasted. Nurses and front line staff are not given sufficient resources to do their jobs properly because all the money is being wasted on bureaucracy and middle management. I do not think that people who have never been a nurse or paramedic should criticise them - it is a job most of us would not want to do and I have every admiration for anyone who does it.

bendix

SuzieSue wrote: »

The main reason for this is that the money is not being spent properly - it is being wasted. Nurses and front line staff are not given sufficient resources to do their jobs properly because all the money is being wasted on bureaucracy and middle management. I do not think that people who have never been a nurse or paramedic should criticise them - it is a job most of us would not want to do and I have every admiration for anyone who does it.

I keep hearing that time and time again. I wonder though, if it's true. It sounds like a lovely cliched refrain promulgated by the tabloids and those involved who inevitably look to 'blame management' for their own failings.

Still, the same thing happens in the private sector :-)

I guess the other key point is that the desire to be a nurse or paramedic is dwindling, hence the demand for hiring staff from Philippines and Indonesia these days. No doubt, the angel British nurses consider themselves above cleaning people's a***s for a living now.

donaldtramp

I guess the other key point is that the desire to be a nurse or paramedic is dwindling, hence the demand for hiring staff from Philippines and Indonesia these days. No doubt, the angel British nurses consider themselves above cleaning people's a***s for a living now.

This is already the case with a great deal of jobs in the private sector.
It would seem that most of Britain's underclass are "above" (seriously they think they are above certain jobs) and we are having to import hard working immigrants to cover our lazy fat underclass who are too busy watching Sky and eating to get of their a£$e an get a job.

Brown has introduced benefits for this and tax credits for that,

What's the result?

MILIONS of lazy underclass sitting watching Jereny Kyle while we water, feed and house them.

bendix

donaldtramp wrote: »

This is already the case with a great deal of jobs in the private sector.
It would seem that most of Britain's underclass are "above" (seriously they think they are above certain jobs) and we are having to import hard working immigrants to cover our lazy fat underclass who are too busy watching Sky and eating to get of their a£$e an get a job.

Brown has introduced benefits for this and tax credits for that,

What's the result?

MILIONS of lazy underclass sitting watching Jereny Kyle while we water, feed and house them.

And the irony is, donald, that is those millions of benefit dependent wasters who are more likely to despise the immigrants for being here, and enabling them to sit around all day, scratching themselves while watching tv.

Great, isnt it?

movingforward2010

bendix wrote: »

With the greatest of respect, you yourself stated in an early post that you were only doing the public sector stuff to make money while you studied (very admirable, by the way).

So do you see it as a good place to work, and a viable long term career option. If so, why? If not, why not?

I'm genuinely interested.

TBH it is not the great job people think, as mentioned before to get a 'gold plated pension' you have to be right at the top, my pension isnt going to be anything to shout from the roof tops about. In the dept i work for rules are constantly brought in which actually serve no purpose, there are so many rules just for the sake of it many just to make our jobs harder. I'd love to be able to tell you its a fantastic job but imo its not, job security in the public sector isn't what it used to, we've already been told by 2011 lots more of our jobs will be cut.

Dont get me wrong, I do have times when I enjoy it, but not for the money or the benefits because for the ones that actually do the front line work, that take abuse from from an irate JSA claimant, get threatened with knifes in the job centre because protective screens where removed, the actual benefits are low. All we get is £15k a year and a very small pension, I'd love to know where the fantastic benefits people go on about are.

Im not asking for sympathy or a cheering squad, I chose to do the job and i accept responsibility for it. But it really upsets me when people label us all as lazy and useless. I applied for my job because i became unemployed, I didn't once think it was going to be easy, or was my sole intention to 'shaft' the tax payer, I go in to work and do my job the best i can.

When comments come up on here as mentioned above people will obviously defend their position.

My choice to study was personal, i want to have a job i really enjoy doing, i want to better myself, i want to have more money than I earn now, and i dont believe i will ever get rich working in the public sector, and quite rightly as its tax payers money.
At the end of the day there are jobs in the public sector that need doing and as mentioned perhaps some that dont, for the time being these vacancies will be filled and if one isn't filled by me it will be by someone else.