Flaming Bears

shakerbaby

What is it about the mentality and psyche of bulls that they flame and bait the bears who simply want cheaper housing for all and a more stable economy where money is spent on more goods and services apart from financing a ridiculous mortgage?

nearlynew

All HPI cheereleaders are debt junkies.

shakerbaby

nearlynew wrote: »

All HPI cheereleaders are debt junkies.

They need HPI to save them?

julieq

Most "bulls" aren't bulls, as a rule we're fairly moderate in what we believe. There is certainly a lot less baiting of bears by the "bulls" than there is of anyone judged by those on the bearish side to be in the enemy camp, you can see that (already) on this thread. That's because in many respects the bear side argument is one almost of religious faith.

For every example you can find me of a "bull" baiting a bear, I can find another in the opposite sense. That's the nature of debate really, it's part of the game.

nearlynew

shakerbaby wrote: »

They need HPI to save them?

Correct.

They don't have any money you see, they have equity.
And equity allows them to borrow more.

And get this - they also think that the larger your mortgage, the richer you are.

I know, I know, it's ridiculous.
But it's true.

shakerbaby

nearlynew wrote: »

Correct.

They don't have any money you see, they have equity.
And equity allows them to borrow more.

And get this - they also think that the larger your mortgage, the richer you are.

I know, I know, it's ridiculous.
But it's true.

Absolute madness. Thanks for the clear and concise explanation into their thinking. :beer:

nearlynew

You're welcome.

julieq

This is baiting in itself, and it's a gross generalisation too. I don't think like that, I don't think Hamish or Chucky or any of the other people here arguing against some of the bear side conclusions think like that.

The fact is that the housing market is based on an aggregate of self interest, and if you want to keep a lid on prices you have to stop (for example) people competing for houses at multiples of joint income. Otherwise SOME people will choose to prioritise their spending so they can live in the house they want.

The "bull" side of the argument is really looking about what is happening and why, where it appears a lot of the "bear" side is about wanting things to be different, in effect it's about wishful thinking.

When the market was collapsing last year, the bears were very dismissive of the "bull" arguments in the face of what appeared to be a straight line heading over the edge of a cliff. Now the declines have reversed to an extent, there's obviously going to be a bit of afters from that. But I don't see much from the "bull" posters that's positive, I've been saying that the recovery looks fragile and expect nothing more than 5 years of stagnation in house prices, Hamish is predicting winter falls. Meanwhile the uber bears are moving onto the next doom scenario du jour, peak oil, energy crisis, food crisis, whatever. Plus ca change...

1echidna

Forgive my ignorance but I thought 'bulls' by definition were those who think a market is going to rise, whereas 'bears' are those who think a market is going to fall. Why the assumpion that 'bulls' will benefit from a rise and 'bears' vice versa? For example I am a bit 'bearish' in my outlook but would benefit if house prices and stockmarkets rose.

tomterm8

Personally, I think people should stop whining on about bull baiting, and the flaming bears, and get on with the important things in life. Such as saving 4p a can on baked beans.

1echidna wrote: »

Forgive my ignorance but I thought 'bulls' by definition were those who think a market is going to rise, whereas 'bears' are those who think a market is going to fall. .

'Bulls' are people net long on a market, 'Bears' are people net short on a market, 'Chickens' like me don't have any investment (at least in the housing market), and don't matter.

shakerbaby

1echidna wrote: »

Forgive my ignorance but I thought 'bulls' by definition were those who think a market is going to rise, whereas 'bears' are those who think a market is going to fall. Why the assumpion that 'bulls' will benefit from a rise and 'bears' vice versa? For example I am a bit 'bearish' in my outlook but would benefit if house prices and stockmarkets rose.

You are a bull-bear?