Gave dog back to breeder, refusing to give money back

mattuk80

SaucySecrets wrote: »

I wouldn't send that letter, if I was you.

My sister did the same thing with a kitten. Exactly the same. She reserved the kitten, picked it up when it was ready, and had it for a night. She then found out she couldn't have a kitten, her new build flat was 'allergy safe', and she couldn't stay there with it. She took it back on the agreement that she'd get her money back, minus 1/3 for the inconvenience.

She was told to expect a cheque, which never arrived, so eventually it went to court. My sister lost. The verbal contract was broken, but it was her word against the breeders as to whether it was ever made, so the court decided if my sister could not prove a contract, none could be presumed to have existed.

The only contract that could be proven was my sister agreeing to take a kitten, paying for it and returning it. The breeder had originally been happy to have the £600 my sister paid for the kitten to cover this, but the court worked out EXACTLY how much the kitten cost her, including the costs of the mother cat involved, and how much she was likely to cost for the rest of her life, "as she could not be presumed to be able to be sold on." My sister had to pay that in compensation to the breeder, which was an extra £900, and court costs for both parties.

Your mum broke the only contract which can be proved, and while it sounds that she made the best decision in the end, you won't be able to prove beyond reasonable doubt that a new contract existed. I'd put this one down to experience, or it could be a costly lesson to learn.

Thanks Saucysecrets, sound advice.

mattuk80

janninew wrote: »

Hi

I've read this post with interest and wanted to add my opinion. I am a breeder of a giant breed dog (wasn't sure if i could put the breed!) and my main interest is the welfare of my puppies. I vet all potential dog owners very carefully, i've refused to sell my puppies on more than one occasion because something just doesn't feel right, i put all my time and effort into raising these pups, that they must go to excellent homes!

If a person wanted to return a puppy to me after 2 days i would take it back and refund all money, no questions. Having the puppy back home with me is the most important thing, and also being a respected breeder (don't like to blow my own trumpet!!) i always have a waiting list of people wanting a puppy, so would have no problems selling this puppy to the right home! I do have a contract that says all dogs must be returned to me if the owner can't look after them (this stands for the life of the dog) but there is nothing about refunding money - maybe i should look into this?! From my own point of view, i would just be glad that they returned the pup to me, i wouldn't want a legal battle over a few hundred pounds, especially as i would be able to sell the pup on for the original purchase price.

I hope the OP can sort this out without to much hassle.

Thankyou for your comments janninew, I think saucysecrets right, might have to put it down to experience.

janninew

mattuk80 wrote: »

Thankyou for your comments janninew, I think saucysecrets right, might have to put it down to experience.

Your very welcome! I know its not always easy reading advice on these forums, but if your Mother bought the dog of me i would just be grateful to have it back, i have on one occasion gone to collect one of my dogs (300 round mile car trip) because the couple had split up and the lady was left with the dog and she couldn't cope and didn't drive. I never hesitated,and i didn't ask for any money, was just glad that she contacted me.

toshkininny

I suppose you could always try CAB ?

BitterAndTwisted

Simon_P wrote: »

Why? Don't they have Pedigree's in rescue centres then?

Unfortunately the answer is "Yes, lots and lots" and the reason is that an awful lot of people make what appear to be rash, uninformed decisions about the reality of keeping and training a highly intelligent animal with no experience or aptitude or a true understanding of the traits of the particular breed. The difference between buying a pup from a breeder and re-homing from a sensible rescue is that the rescues invariably interview and home-visit prospective new owners and attempt to match the dog with the new family, taking into account lots of things, especially the new owner's ability to provide the dog or pup with a satisfactory and appropriate home environment. I'd bet that the majority of amateur breeders do no such thing.

Frugalista

mattuk80 wrote: »

Her friend rang today and said the breeder won't have time to sell her. She shouldn't say on Thursday "I can't give you any money back until I sell her" and then suddenly change this to "I don't have time to sell her".

So you haven't actually spoken to the breeder since returning the pup?

mattuk80 wrote: »

The Breeder has now reneged on that agreement by changing her terms.

So, have you actually spoken to the breeder herself?

mattuk80 wrote: »

The breeder has reneged on her agreement to make a refund (whether it be partial or full) when reselling the dog.

she has broken her agreement with my mother to pay her a refund once the dog was resold.

Has the actual breeder herself said that?

mattuk80 wrote: »

If she had not said "I cannot give you a refund until I resell the dog" then fair enough but she did say that. Why should she be allowed to suddenly change her mind?

Have I missed the bit where the breeder said she had changed her mind?

I thought it was her friend your (emotional, stressed & confused) mother had spoken to?

VoucherMan

For legal advice you could try asking the question here.
Your not guaranteed a reply, and from the replies you've got so far on this thread I doubt the answer will much different, but there are some helpful people on the thread

As for the unhelpful comments -

Rather than thinking of the £500 lost think of the thousands in food and vets bills that have been saved.

tiamai_d

The sale of a dog is covered under the general terms of the Sales of Goods Act 1979. But if you look it up, you are not entitled to an automatic refund. By law stores (or in this case the breeder) don't have to have a returns policy, but if they do, they must stick to it, as it forms part of your contract with them.

Which means that the breeder didn't have to take the pup back at all.

However, in the eyes of the law your mother gifted the pup not to the breeder, but to another party, so it is no longer her legal property.

It is then up to the discretion of whoever has the pup whether to return the pup to your mother (to be passed onto yet another potential keeper).

What has happened is that your mother bought an item, decided she didn't want it and gave it to someone else. I'd be very surprised if any court decided she were entitled to any refund at all. Especially as the pup wasn't returned to the breeder, but to her friend who could decide to keep it. You can't go buying something from M&S and return it to Tesco and think you can get your money back.

lowis

Simon_P wrote: »

Why? Don't they have Pedigree's in rescue centres then?

yes of course they do, in fact there are breed specific rescues...however she would not have lost £500 if she had gone to a rescue centre.

lowis

Brightness wrote: »

Lowis, I beg to differ on your first comment. Any dog 'purchased' from a rescue centre is actually still the property of that rescue until its dying day and the money you hand over is merely a 'donation'!

As for the situation of OP's mother all I can say is serves her right. It's about time breeders took a firm stance with people who mess about with puppies lives.

I have just taken on an 8mth rescue who was so screwed up when we got him thanks to someone like OP's mum who handed him back to the breeder after deciding that she no longer wanted him. OK so she kept him a little longer but she'd reserved him from a very early age and so stopped someone else from having him.

Thankfully I know the breeder and she let him come to live with us where he is living the life of riley and learning how to be a dog.

I honestly think that people should ahve to take some sort of test before they are allowed to have an animal of any kind and also think that licensing should be brought back.

Incidentally, just wondering what sort of breed this dog is and whether the breeder is KC reg'd or not.....

you miss my point...she wouldn't be £500 out of pocket would she, just the donation.