WARNING - Ryanair 'online check in' farce

peterbaker

PolishBigSpender wrote: »

In Poland, we aren't so mollycoddled

Oh and I suppose Poles designed and built Spitfires as well as flew them?

In UK we have values. We well know PBS your own personal tendency in business to offer jobs only to those that do as you say (or else). You have expressed it in this forum.

You are therefore a self-professed exploiter of the labour market, a labour market which is largely made up of good people with moral standards with regard to their fellow man/co-workers that self-evidently exceed yours, and who, in fear of job loss, will cow to bullying if not helped by people who will root it out.

You make me feel quite nauseous. Do your parents and grandparents know you are out mischief-making?

PolishBigSpender

peterbaker wrote: »

Oh and I suppose Poles designed and built Spitfires as well as flew them?

Who flew Spitfires is neither here nor there.

In UK we have values. We well know PBS your own personal tendency to offer jobs only to those that do as you say. You have expressed it in this forum.

Of course. An obedient workforce produces greater results than a workforce that isn't. Woolworths being again a fantastic example of what happens when your workforce largely ignore what you wish to carry out.

Ryanair are succesful because their workforce works hard to fufil the tasks set.

You are therefore a self-expressed exploiter of the labour market, a labour market which is largely in fear of job loss.

Yes. What has this got to do with Ryanair?

peterbaker

PolishBigSpender wrote: »

Who flew Spitfires is neither here nor there.

Well perhaps not. But some Brits who understood bullying from their schooldays, and stood up to a particular bully in Europe, did actually build something rather important with which to smite him, and then those that flew those wonderfully crafted machines were not so much doing exactly what they were told as doing what they very much liked, or so I have been led to believe:p. I think shared values entered into it, too.

Of course. An obedient workforce produces greater results than a workforce that isn't. Woolworths being again a fantastic example of what happens when your workforce largely ignore what you wish to carry out.

I assume you have not grown up with Woolworths, so I can forgive your ill-advised choice of a case study. You must surely realise that Woolworths never advanced much beyond Pick n' Mix, a front-of house idea from the 60s? They have for my entire lifetime been pretty much a white elephant, and I do not believe anyone has aspired to their business practices for more than 50 years.

Ryanair are succesful because their workforce works hard to fufil the tasks set.

No they do not. Many are exploited, do not care and are lazy. I myself cleaned the toilet in the rear of a 737-800 two days ago to make a point to the lazy economic migrants masquerading as No3 and No 4 cabin crew in the rear of my aircraft. I was the first to visit the toilets after take-off. The toilets were annoyingly neglected (by them). They told me it was not their job because they handled food. I told them I had now cleaned the toilet and the floor, had properly washed my hands and would now like a sandwich if by any chance they had also washed their hands properly in the recent past. They seemed unable to confirm that they had. I do hope they got the point, and that you might too, PBS.

Yes. What has this got to do with Ryanair?

Everything. Ryanair only survives by exploiting the labour market by bullying, and evidently by trying to bully airport operators and their employees too. They are notorious for breaking EU Employment Law with absolutely no compunction whatsoever, in the same way that they are notorious for breaking EU consumer law. Are you an advocate of similar lawbreaking, PBS? Do you see opportunity for business profit in a labour market and consumer market where flouting of the law passes as 'normal'?

PolishBigSpender

peterbaker wrote: »

I assume you have not grown up with Woolworths, so I can forgive your ill-advised choice of a case study. You must surely realise that Woolworths never advanced much beyond Pick n' Mix, a front-of house idea from the 60s? They have for my entire lifetime been pretty much a white elephant, and I do not believe anyone has aspired to their business practices for more than 50 years.

I could name others. In fact, a famous British success story - Tesco - succeeded because they managed to get the workforce to work for Tesco and not for themselves. It's why they've succeeded in Poland where others have failed.

The fundamental rule of business is that you have to utilise your resources in the most effective way. Ryanair and Tesco succeed at this - and many 'flag carriers' have failed at doing just that. Whether the resources are animal, vegetable or mineral, it really isn't here nor there - ultimately, they have to work to allow the business to succeed.

No they do not. Many are exploited, do not care and are lazy. I myself cleaned the toilet in the rear of a 737-800 two days ago to make a point to the lazy economic migrants masquerading as No3 and No 4 cabin crew in the rear of my aircraft.

Your assumption that they were economic migrants (when they may not even have been based at the airport in question!) says a lot. Anyway, Ryanair staff do work much harder than their overpaid, lazy counterparts with legacy airlines. If you don't wish to believe this, then I invite you to take a Ryanair flight and then a LOT flight.

I don't think anyone in the aviation industy will deny the commitment that Ryanair demands and receives from their human resources.

I was the first to visit the toilets after take-off. The toilets were annoyingly neglected (by them). They told me it was not their job because they handled food.

As far as I'm aware, cleaning the aircraft (beyond what they do before landing) isn't the responsibility of the cabin crew.

I told them I had now cleaned the toilet and the floor, had properly washed my hands and would now like a sandwich if by any chance they had also washed their hands properly in the recent past. They seemed unable to confirm that they had. I do hope they got the point, and that you might too, PBS.

What point, apart from that people are willing to do the dirty jobs and thus save Ryanair more money?

Everything. Ryanair only survives by exploiting the labour market by bullying. They are notorious for breaking EU Employment Law with absolutely no compunction whatsoever, in the same way that they are notorious for breaking EU consumer law. Are you an advocate of similar lawbreaking, PBS? Do you see opportunity for business profit in a labour market and consumer market where flouting of the law passes as 'normal' ?

France as a nation regularly flouts EU law surrounding fair trials. HMRC in the UK regularly breaks EU law. Germany provides illegal state aid on just the right side of legality. Italy and Spain frequently break EU law surrounding all sorts of things. Is there in fact anyone who doesn't break EU law in some sort of way?

Ryanair doesn't need to bully their staff - they simply fire anyone who doesn't perform. Any good business will do the same - and in fact, any good manager will demand nothing but 100% commitment from their staff during work hours.

I find it sad that people feel the need to attack successful businesses rather than embracing them.

peterbaker

I find it sad that the leaders of a successful business cannot grow up and take the responsibility which comes with taking so much money that society is skewed by their personal moral standards.

France as a nation regularly flouts EU law surrounding fair trials. HMRC in the UK regularly breaks EU law. Germany provides illegal state aid on just the right side of legality. Italy and Spain frequently break EU law surrounding all sorts of things. Is there in fact anyone who doesn't break EU law in some sort of way?

So indeed you are an advocate of opportunist law-breaking in pursuit of your own business agenda, putting yourself or your business in the supposedly unassailable position of any of a number of your selected elected governments of various chosen erring European states, no less?

Who elected you?

When businesses get that big, or that uppity, then maybe it is time for them to behave when told (like you are so fond of telling employees, PBS), or for them to be absorbed as part of the government, or simply to go elsewhere.

PolishBigSpender

peterbaker wrote: »

I find it sad that the leaders of a successful business cannot grow up and take the responsibility which comes with taking so much money that society is skewed by their personal moral standards.

Arguably, O'Leary is much more socially responsible than his equal at BA. For a start, Ryanair seek to minimise consumption as much as possible - as witnessed by the ban on staff charging their personal mobiles at work. Then there's the fact that Ryanair are attempting to actually carry as little as possible into the sky - again, much more environmentally and socially aware. And let's not forget the donations to charity that Ryanair make, yet don't crow about.

So indeed you are an advocate of opportunist law-breaking in pursuit of your own business agenda, putting yourself or your business in the supposedly unassailable position of any of a number of your selected elected governments of various chosen erring European states, no less?

I'm an advocate of a free market from which 450 million Europeans can benefit from. I'm not a fan of overly restrictive employment laws, including the ones which force me to employ people on temporary contracts.

Nothing to do with Ryanair, though.

Who elected you?

Money did.

When businesses get that big, or that uppity, then maybe it is time for them to behave when told (like you are so fond of telling employees, PBS), or for them to be absorbed as part of the government, or simply to go elsewhere.

You can continue all the theoretical thinking, but I'll remind you that money buys influence within government. For that reason, you won't see Ryanair nationalised or indeed restricted in any way. I really can't see the Irish government doing *anything* which threatens Ryanair - for a start, the amount of money paid in Irish corporation tax will avoid any real trouble

peterbaker

Now don't make me laugh PBS ... I didn't even know that Ryanair staff couldn't charge their mobiles at work - you must surely be an insider to pull that one out of the hat. And Ryanair attempts to carry less into the sky? What about the spare mobile phone batteries that six members of staff now have to take with them on each flight? And that "Duty Free" (sic) trolley of perfume that they roll up and down every flight - the one where the Ryanair price is as much as 4x high street prices £/ml ? Does anyone really buy at those prices? Some of that stock has bounced off the floor so many times that I'd be surprised it is all still merchantable, but still they load it up, every flight.

And don't forget all those tonnes of fuel Ryanair tankers around Europe from cheap fuel airports to expensive fuel airports to suit it's own bottom line and politics, or am I overlooking that it is some kind of indirect charitable service to customers? Is that the real reason that Ryanair wants its actual passenger and baggage load trimmed to the bone i.e. so it has more capacity to move tonnes of unused cheap fuel around the sky instead?

And donations to charity ... that other old chestnut ... how much exactly as a proportion of Ryanair's pre-tax profit would that be? 10% might be worth crowing about. No can do? OK what about the proportion of scratchcard sales revenue that goes to charity? That gets crowed about on every flight - but as a percentage, just remind me what it is again? :rotfl:

You are probably right about the Irish government's take on things O'Leary, but I wouldn't be so sure about the UK government's view/take on it. And as you have already alluded to it, we do know the French government's view, eh?

jammin_2

!!!!!! - not another thread with PBS off on his high horse again.

*unsubscribes from thread*

connlach

I totally agree, I recently put up another reminder on this thread so people dont make a mistake and it has got totally lost by a Ryanair love in again. I fly Ryanair all the time, you get what you pay for, you make mistakes etc. I like to fly with them because they are cheap and they go where I want them to, but it doesn't make them perfect or want me to have O'Leary's love child. PBS change your attitude or go and start your own threads about your desire to work for the flying harp.

PolishBigSpender

peterbaker wrote: »

Now don't make me laugh PBS ... I didn't even know that Ryanair staff couldn't charge their mobiles at work - you must surely be an insider to pull that one out of the hat.

http://www.google.pl/#hl=pl&source=hp&q=ryanair+staff+charging+mobiles&btnG=Szukaj+w+Google&lr=&aq=f&oq=ryanair+staff+charging+mobiles&fp=d766f15c0ca9ebbd

You don't even know about Ryanair's operations, do you?

And Ryanair attempts to carry less into the sky? What about the spare mobile phone batteries that six members of staff now have to take with them on each flight?

Source?

And that "Duty Free" (sic) trolley of perfume that they roll up and down every flight - the one where the Ryanair price is as much as 4x high street prices £/ml ? Does anyone really buy at those prices? Some of that stock has bounced off the floor so many times that I'd be surprised it is all still merchantable, but still they load it up, every flight.

They wouldn't take it if people didn't buy it.

And don't forget all those tonnes of fuel Ryanair tankers around Europe from cheap fuel airports to expensive fuel airports to suit it's own bottom line and politics, or am I overlooking that it is some kind of indirect charitable service to customers?

Now it's obvious that you know very little about aviation operations. Ryanair don't carry around 'spare fuel' - in fact, Ryanair will normally put enough in for the relevant sector and no more. The cost of taking spare fuel would more than outweigh the costs of buying from 'cheap' airports - and let's bear in mind that aviation fuel isn't taxed in the EU anyway!

And donations to charity ... that other old chestnut ... how much exactly as a proportion of Ryanair's pre-tax profit would that be? 10% might be worth crowing about. No can do? OK what about the proportion of scratchcard sales revenue that goes to charity? That gets crowed about on every flight - but as a percentage, just remind me what it is again? :rotfl:

I'm sure the revenue raised daily is significant enough to make a difference.

You are probably right about the Irish government's take on things O'Leary, but I wouldn't be so sure about the UK government's view/take on it. And as you have already alluded to it, we do know the French government's view, eh?

The UK government won't touch Ryanair in any meaningful way either. The amount of APD raised by Ryanair is significant, along with the fact that Ryanair effectively keeps Stansted as being a worthwhile airport, along with quite a few other airports.