Consumer Rights Discussion area

LD

I am having a problem with Orange. We upgraded our 7 company phones in October, less than 3 months ago. Three of the seven headsets supplied in the box with the phones directly from Nokia.

When I tried to return the headsets for a replacement, the shop staff kept repeating that they were not responsible for the headsets, and to return them to the manufacturer. I tried to refer them to the Sale of Goods Act,  that they were responsible for the goods that they sell, not the manufacturer, but still got the answer that they didn't guarantee the accessories.

I even threatened the shop with Trading Standards, they said fine!!!

I am not prepared to go through the hassle of sending the headsets to Nokia, and waiting forever for them to return them to me.

I wouldn't mind, but we have a total of seven phones and have been customers since 1999. By the way, I have threatened to move elsewhere at the end of the contract, and they are calling my bluff. To tell you the truth, I can't face the hassle again that we had from Cellnet when we moved to Orange.

assuming the h/sets are faulty
write a letter to them stating what has been said by both parties, indicate that you will now purchase replacements and recovery the cost from them, bill them, give them 14 days to pay, then take out a summons (can do it online) sue for the costs of replacements, cost of your visits to the shop (time/petrol/parking), cost of issuing invoice ie. ALL costs incurred upto the point you sue, unlikely they will file defence 14 days after issue apply for summary judgement - tip write the letter with the court case in mine so it can easily be converted into particulars of claim,non lawyers can't claim for the cost of writing the summons but can for previous time spent

trace-j

As with all consumer purchases you have the right to a reasonable time to examine any item to make sure if it's of satisfactory quality- e.g. not damaged, does what it's supposed to etc.

It is for this reason a trader cannot rely on a signed deliver note to say it's ok- because you have to basically unpack, plug in etc and no courier will hang around for you to do that!  Also some items may take a lot longer to examine depending on what it does- e.g. some electricals.

If its been in the cupboard for a couple of months unchecked, legally you may be backed into a corner.  If the item was purchased from a high street store and was covered in dents the same situation would apply- it is an easy fault to find and is reasonable to say you should have been found as soon as you got it.  

As you didn't complain sooner you're suppose silence of the fault can be interpreted as acceptance of it.  Sorry its a bit negative, but no harm in complaining explaining it was a Crimbo pressie.

Some companies do make allowances for returns on unwanted pressies at Christmas (provided they are unused) but they have no legal duty to do this.  In this case its a faulty product so the above would apply.

trace-j

Orange are complete rougues, trust me.  Firstly you'll need to check whether the Orange shop you're dealing with is in fact owned by Orange (the company) or is an Orange authorised dealer, i.e. a franchise.  The Business Name and address should be on a sign in the shop and on any receipts.  This will determine who deals with what contractually.  If its an Orange company owned shop they'll have to deal with everything handset/other goods and contract.

If it's a franchise the shop will be legally responsible for goods sold and Orange company will be legally responsible for the contract (as they will act as an agent).  However, the finer points will always be in the contract at the time of sale.

Basic Consumer Rights puts the onus on the party you paid money to to prove the goods you have purchased was not faulty at the time of purchase for the first 6mths  (ref: Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumer Regulations).  After this time you'll have to somehow prove it was faulty at the time of purchase.  Orange cannot put a 28 day policy on the basic consumer right that a good must be of satisfactory quality for a  reasonable time.  They cannot also bat you off to the manufacturer.

As it is a common thing for this tripe to be given verbally by Orange shops, best thing is write via recorded delivery to either the franchise shop or the Orange company head office as appropriate seeking refund, replacement depending on what you're entitled to.  You won't get anywhere by writing to the Head Office when a franchise sold the handset.  

If after this you still come up against the 28 day thing write to your local Trading Standards stating that they may enforcing a restrictive statement on consumer rights.  They can't enforce your rights but can make their own enquiries into this practice.  Also Trading Standards can take action in seeking a assurance from companies who continue to breach consumer rights provided there is evidence of complaints, so even if nothing can be done in individual cases a record of complaints may help in proving such practices in the future.  See also http://www.dti.gov.uk/ccp/topics1/facts/enterpriseact8.htm

All the above can apply to company phones too.  However the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regs unfortunately doesn't apply to businesses.  There is no 6mth burden of proof on the seller and there is no replacement remedy available.

This means a business will have to prove any faults as the old Sale of Goods Act applies.  If there are any faults, you're only rights are a refund (if soon after purchase) or repair which isn't easy to sort out. The shop will still be responsible for making sure any order is complete (no items missing etc).

Dealing with this company verbally when things go wrong is like hitting your head against a brick wall, but if you set out your case in writing and know what buttons to press you'll get results- they don't want to go to court.  As for trying to sell you something else- they are relying on consumers not being fully aware of their rights to make a profit. After all you'll be tied into a longer contract if you upgrade instead of fighting for that replacement you may be entitled to.

Hope this helps a bit

Slasher_2

I bought a Freeview box (Hauppauge DEC-2000) from Maplin 6 months ago, this product has a 2 year manufacturers guarantee, but it recently broke so I sent it back to Maplin for a repair or replacement. I specifically did not ask for a refund as I bought it for a good price of £55 but it now costs at least £110.

I have received a letter from Maplin stating they have refunded my money, which was against my wishes. I rang to complain but they said they cannot replace the product as they no longer stock it, and have no alternative product to give me. (They did offer one item at extra cost(!) but, on checking, it is not an equivalent item). I asked for the broken product to be returned to me instead of the refund but they said it was not possible as it had been returned to supplier.

I complained that I would not have sent it to them if I had known they would take the cheapest option for themselves which was a refund. Instead I would have sent it to the manufacturer under the 2 year guarantee where most likely it would have been repaired.

It seems to me that Maplin have disposed of customer service as well as my personal property, and left me at least £55 out of pocket because the replacement cost will be over £110, I can't find it cheaper.

I was wondering if anybody else has been in this position and whether I would have any legal redress in this case?

I did contact Trading Standards who weren't entirely sure, but did mention that the law changed last year which now covers out-of-pocket expenses incurred when a product is sent for repair/replacement.

Any help or comments on this situation would be grateful.

fififolle

Having problems with IKEA - bought bedroom furniture in December and had it delivered (at a cost of £90) - today I went to assemble my new bed to discover that 1 of 3 necessary boxes was not delivered. I phoned IKEA today who are being really awkward, saying they are refusing to release the 3rd box until I have proof of purchase (thankfully I have a visa bill). I am now left without a bed and not sure when I will get this resolved..... any advice?

mew

I bought A Philips DVD Recorder from Sainsbury's last year. While it is 'working' it has (and has had) several minor faults. At the moment It doesn't always record programs and frequently causes inference with my other AV Equipment. Philips always tell me to download the latest software update (which I do) but this hasn't solved all the problems.

Can I take the player back to Sainsbury's for a replacement refund or do I have to persit in contacting Philips?

purplepatch

I bought a load of towels and bath mats yesterday which had overkill on tags attached by those horrible little plastic tags. I have to admit that I never cut these with scissors, always pull them to break. Unfortunately removal from one of the bath mats resulted in a snag, which is now growing similar to a ladder in a stocking! I'm really annoyed with myself for not removing it more carefully, but feel a bit disgruntled that it is the stupid way that they insert these tags that has caused the problem. Do I have a leg to stand on if I take it back? Or should I just lie and say that the snag was already there? Hate lying but surely they have to take my word for it even if they don't believe me...

Can anyone offer any advice?

trpadd

Just thought I would give people an update on my dealings with GM-Daewoo/Chevrolet. They have steadfastly refused to replace the CD Autochanger that was replaced under guarantee and failed 7mths later with the same problem when my vehicle was out of warranty. Latest correspondence from Chevrolet (recieved today) basically says that I have no statutory rights in this matter as the Sale of Goods Act does not apply as the good were supplied free of charge under a guarantee. A couple of weeks ago I did write to my solicitor to see if it could be progressed that way and was told he could not help me in the matter. Looks as though I am well and truly stuffed! (

debbie_kruk

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trpadd

debbie_kruk wrote:

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Loaded okay for me