performing rights society... R-soles.....

waaag

A family friend has a small takeaway business, fairly new. The performing rights society has told him he must pay a fee as he uses a tv in the shop, chinese channels only, for which he pays a tv licence.

I think they (PRS) say that because there is 'music' coming out of the tv, theme tunes/adverts, - this is why he must pay PRS charge., .....and that the music makes customers come in and that means the whole reason they get customers at all is that they only want to come to the music and then any subsequent food purchase is just coincidental!!!.... :rotfl:Yes, really.....

They say they do their job to ensure that all the correct musicians are paid royalties.

So, does anybody know how they do this?

1) How exactly do they determine how many times an artists music has been played on the tv in the shop in a day?

2) How do they determine the (chinese) name of the artist, ascertain whether their music is copyright protected, and track them down? and pay them their 'royalties'...??

I think it is a massive money making scam that needs a decent lawyer to sort them out. Has anybody else come across this? I have never heard the likes of it...

Oh and interestingly why in the parade of shops where the friends new takeaway is, are there no PRS stickers (to prove you've been forced to pay,) on any other shop windows? How do they select their victims? just new/young/foreign businesses? is it?

Interestingly they phoned the takeway,(not long after the owners were forced to pay money for the licence,) asking all of the questions which have already been answered on the form, and trying to find out if it was a restaureant or a takeaway, (bigger fees for restaurant), the woman said she had 6 questions to ask, asked the first one "what music do you listen to in the RESTAURANT..." she was corrected that it was a TAKEAWAY, and that any music heard was from tv...licence paid for..she then hung up....funny that.....

SORRY IF I PUT THIS IN WRONG SECTION!! COULDN'T THINK WHERE TO POST IT...

DCodd

There is a very large thread regarding this here:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=583965

phlogeston

Like most people in this world, artists like to be paid for their work.

Your friend is playing music in a public place and is required by law to have a licence.

The normal TV licence is not a licence for public performances.

The PRS organizes the collection of royalties.

It is not a rip off, it is not a scam. It is a fair method of rewarding artists for their work.

DCodd

phlogeston wrote: »

Like most people in this world, artists like to be paid for their work.

Your friend is playing music in a public place and is required by law to have a licence.

The normal TV licence is not a licence for public performances.

The PRS organizes the collection of royalties.

It is not a rip off, it is not a scam. It is a fair method of rewarding artists for their work.

Let's not start this again!!:rolleyes2

Best that we keep it all in one thread do you not think?

mountainofdebt

phlogeston wrote: »

Like most people in this world, artists like to be paid for their work.

Your friend is playing music in a public place and is required by law to have a licence.

The normal TV licence is not a licence for public performances.

The PRS organizes the collection of royalties.

It is not a rip off, it is not a scam. It is a fair method of rewarding artists for their work.

Whilst I would normally agree with you I think in this case, the PRS are in the wrong.

Otherwise if the PRS are correct, then EVERYONE will not only need a TV licence but a licence from the PRS as well.

I would be tempted to contact PRS and if they have forced the Owners to have a licence under false pretendences then I would demand a refund.

dmg24

waaag wrote: »

A family friend has a small takeaway business, fairly new. The performing rights society has told him he must pay a fee as he uses a tv in the shop, chinese channels only, for which he pays a tv licence.

I think they (PRS) say that because there is 'music' coming out of the tv, theme tunes/adverts, - this is why he must pay PRS charge., .....and that the music makes customers come in and that means the whole reason they get customers at all is that they only want to come to the music and then any subsequent food purchase is just coincidental!!!.... :rotfl:Yes, really.....

They say they do their job to ensure that all the correct musicians are paid royalties.

So, does anybody know how they do this?

1) How exactly do they determine how many times an artists music has been played on the tv in the shop in a day?

2) How do they determine the (chinese) name of the artist, ascertain whether their music is copyright protected, and track them down? and pay them their 'royalties'...??

I think it is a massive money making scam that needs a decent lawyer to sort them out. Has anybody else come across this? I have never heard the likes of it...

Oh and interestingly why in the parade of shops where the friends new takeaway is, are there no PRS stickers (to prove you've been forced to pay,) on any other shop windows? How do they select their victims? just new/young/foreign businesses? is it?

Interestingly they phoned the takeway,(not long after the owners were forced to pay money for the licence,) asking all of the questions which have already been answered on the form, and trying to find out if it was a restaureant or a takeaway, (bigger fees for restaurant), the woman said she had 6 questions to ask, asked the first one "what music do you listen to in the RESTAURANT..." she was corrected that it was a TAKEAWAY, and that any music heard was from tv...licence paid for..she then hung up....funny that.....

SORRY IF I PUT THIS IN WRONG SECTION!! COULDN'T THINK WHERE TO POST IT...

Nowhere in your post do you explain why they are 'R-soles'? Is someone an 'R-sole' just because you do not agree with them?

DCodd

With the risk of starting another massive thread on this topic, I would say that in this case I would think the PRS are not requesting a PRS licence but as they have joined with the Public Performance Licence (PPL) in collecting fees, they are asking for a PPL. As a PRS licence is not required (especially as the broadcast is in Chinese) as no financial benefit can possiblely be proved.

iolanthe07

I hate music in shops anyway. I leave as fast as I can and will always patronise shops that don't have piped music, if I possibly can. Piped music in restaurants and pubs is horrible too. Good on Wetherspoons for not allowing it.

waaag

tHANKS FOR DIRECTING ME TO THE THREAD, DCODD..I have read it! Its interesting and clearly a few answers from people who work for them too.....:D

waaag

DCodd wrote: »

With the risk of starting another massive thread on this topic, I would say that in this case I would think the PRS are not requesting a PRS licence but as they have joined with the Public Performance Licence (PPL) in collecting fees, they are asking for a PPL. As a PRS licence is not required (especially as the broadcast is in Chinese) as no financial benefit can possiblely be proved.

Yes I completely agree, but up in their shop is a sticker on the window, and it says PRS, and they have been unfortunately forced to pay it, I think they were picked on because they are foreign....and young, and a new business...

When will the PRS be going and stopping the boy racers up and down seafronts/gathering places with loud music pumping from their cars then, ??? ah hang on - they're not easy targets though are they.......yes more chance of lord lucan winning the grand national on shergar....:rotfl:

stugib

They've been hassling my wife in work - consisting of two employees in a broom cupboard office with no visiting public - demanding to know if they ever listen to the radio in work!