Why was IMMMIGRATION ignored in the budget>?

dervish

beer_tins wrote: »

I can think of reasons to get out of the EU, but none of them economic. Businesses, high skill workers and investment would flood out of the country, economists are pretty much united on that point. No major party advocates complete withdrawal from the EU, because it is idiocy, frankly. No question, it needs serious reform, but at the end of the day we need it more than it needs us, as is the case for virtually every EU member.

freedom is sometimes won only at a cost.

beer_tins

dervish wrote: »

freedom is sometimes won only at a cost.

I'm afraid the vast majority of people would agree that the cost is too great. Closing our borders and casting our island adrift in a global economy is economic suicide. In the modern world, the global economy is real and we must (and can) compete in it. I for one don't want the country isolated like North Korea.

*MF*

There are other threads running on this board, dealing with the Budget - and contrary to the OP's post - immigration was addressed in the Budget yesterday - albeit obliquely. The items below are extracts from The Red Book.

Any economy relies, in part, on the ages of its inhabitants, and the relationship between those of working age, and those, say, who are retired - the demographics.

As the items below appears to indicate, the UK is, in comparison, reasonably well placed in that respect.

Does that mean there should be less immigration? On the face of it maybe.

But it is complex ...

- in part because of our membership of the EU (and it enlargement), with the free movement of labour,

- and perhaps also in part because of any "skills shortages", whether at the lower or higher end of the skills spectrum,

- and yesterday's budget may indeed encourage those earning at the higher end of the income scales to leave

- so can the question be solely about immigration, or should it also include the question of emigration - the health of the economy can be dependent on the balance between those two.

Were that not the case, we would not have witnessed immigrants (legal or illegal) coming to this country - they came as a direct result of their comparison of their home country's economy in comparison to ours - and many are now leaving again - having revised that very comparison.

You need only consider the USA, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand - to see the balance - immigration into those countries was a net emigration from others, not least the UK.

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bluey890

beer_tins wrote: »

I'm afraid the vast majority of people would agree that the cost is too great. Closing our borders and casting our island adrift in a global economy is economic suicide. In the modern world, the global economy is real and we must (and can) compete in it. I for one don't want the country isolated like North Korea.

We are discussing limiting migration, and by how much.
The sound bite rhetoric is best left at home.

beer_tins

bluey890 wrote: »

It's not British workers for British jobs you should be so concerned with.
I have yet to see a definition of 'British worker' or 'British job'.

It's about sustainability of the environment and quality of living.
Open green spaces are essential to one's health.

I agree and the best long term solution is to train the existing population to fill our skills gap. trouble is:

a) we're not doing that effectively

and

b) in the short to medium term, we need people to fill these skills gaps.

If we had our own skilled, competitive workforce in all the areas we needed, the vacuum that pulls in immigrant labour would decrease.

beer_tins

bluey890 wrote: »

We are discussing limiting migration, and by how much.
The sound bite rhetoric is best left at home.

According to the OP, it was about ending immigration completely. There was no suggestion about "limiting" it or by how much.

dervish

beer_tins wrote: »

I agree and the best long term solution is to train the existing population to fill our skills gap. trouble is:

a) we're not doing that effectively

and

b) in the short to medium term, we need people to fill these skills gaps.

If we had our own skilled, competitive workforce in all the areas we needed, the vacuum that pulls in immigrant labour would decrease.

I agree with point A.

However I think that foreigners will always be attracted to this country, regardless of any skills gap, as we are seen as a soft touch on immigration.

bluey890

beer_tins wrote: »

I agree and the best long term solution is to train the existing population to fill our skills gap. trouble is:
a) we're not doing that effectively
and
b) in the short to medium term, we need people to fill these skills gaps.
If we had our own skilled, competitive workforce in all the areas we needed, the vacuum that pulls in immigrant labour would decrease.

Migration to fill gaps in highly skilled industry, yes.

The problem is the Home Office is not fit for purpose.

neas

EU immigrants arent really immigrants and theres not alot we can do to stop them coming here.

Although i am biased, people are just people.... theres too many of us for us to have an 'identity' these days..

Living in a small backwater town my wife (who is an Eu citizen. and worked 5 years... paying taxes in england etc) is hearing alot of stupid comments about immigrants causing the problems with economy.

Yes... it was the immigrants who caused house prices to sky rocket to 300%... it was the immigrants who lost billions of pounds lending money to people who shouldn't have been lent to.

You can measure an individuals intelligence inversely by seeing how good they are at blaming problems... on people who really arent the problem.

The problem is.. we are a nanny state, we've sold our gold, oil, assets,.... we've bust our banking industry and don't manufacture anything... we pay large sums of money to jobless lazy bums...... prob the same bums blaming the immigrants for the problems.


The immigrants wouldnt get jobs if english workers wouldnt be so lazy not to do the jobs they fill. Most immigrants either fill skilled jobs.. that we aint got enough people to do... or do menial jobs english are too 'posh' to do.. like farming and fruit picking.

beer_tins

bluey890 wrote: »

Migration to fill gaps in highly skilled industry, yes.

The problem is the Home Office is not fit for purpose.

I agree with much of what your saying. You seem to have a reasoned position on limited immigration. Don't take my responses to dervish to be directed at you. His position is close the borders regardless of the consequences. The fact that he started this debate supposedly based on economics and later says "freedom comes at a cost" means his argument is discredited, as it's not about economics at all.