Advice wanted about uni problem.

welf_man

I'm not quite clear why you didn't leave a written message for him at the Dept. or speak to someone else about the issue on the days you were in?

As you have missed a deadline and been marked to zero, that decision will have to be ratified by the Dept. at some point, and you should be able to appeal against it. I don't see how the lecturer could refuse to let you submit the second part of the assessment, but if he did that should be appealable and also grounds for complaint.

You need to get advice specific to your institution though, so contact the Students' Union Advice Centre as soon as you can.

Mel.

Oldernotwiser

MORPH3US wrote: »

I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to point out with any of that post.

The point I was making, which I thought I expressed quite simply, is that any contribution that students may make towards the cost of their courses, represents only a part of the total cost. I also pointed out that teaching undergraduates is by no means the only function of a university an, in many cases, it isn't even the most important one.

If you work in a university I'm sure you understand the latter point perfectly well, or you would if you were a member of the academic staff.

MrsManda

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

I also pointed out that teaching undergraduates is by no means the only function of a university an, in many cases, it isn't even the most important one.

Not that it's at all relevant to the OP but when I went to my applicant interview we were warned in the group introduction that it was very rare for a member of staff to get a payrise/promotion/recognition for being a great lecturer, they were chosen and valued almost exclusively for their research contribution and the money/reputation that they brought the university. This wasn't to say they wouldn't be there for us if we needed them but we wouldn't have our hands held and it was our responsibility to attend, submit and make the most of the contact time and resources available. I chose the university because of the freedom and the research reputation which that brought.

MORPH3US

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

The point I was making, which I thought I expressed quite simply, is that any contribution that students may make towards the cost of their courses, represents only a part of the total cost. I also pointed out that teaching undergraduates is by no means the only function of a university an, in many cases, it isn't even the most important one.

If you work in a university I'm sure you understand the latter point perfectly well, or you would if you were a member of the academic staff.

Nope, just repeating yourself hasn't explained what you meant... "total cost" of what - running the course or running the whole University. I still fail to see what relevance this has to anything?

And it doesn't matter one bit that teaching undergraduates is not the only or most important part of a university.... does that make them second class citizens, should Uni's say "we don't care about you, you're not as important as X or Y"

Your posts are very strange

I don't work in a University any more, my brain couldn't handle working in the little University bubble any longer... and definately not an academic, that lot are on a different planet.. clever, maybe... real world, not a chance.

Are you an academic oldernotwiser... I get the feeling that you think students are unimportant and aren't worthy of your time, do you have "much too important research to be getting on with"..... its all coming back to me now.

bestpud

MORPH3US wrote: »

Nope, just repeating yourself hasn't explained what you meant... "total cost" of what - running the course or running the whole University. I still fail to see what relevance this has to anything?

And it doesn't matter one bit that teaching undergraduates is not the only or most important part of a university.... does that make them second class citizens, should Uni's say "we don't care about you, you're not as important as X or Y"

Your posts are very strange

I don't work in a University any more, my brain couldn't handle working in the little University bubble any longer... and definately not an academic, that lot are on a different planet.. clever, maybe... real world, not a chance.

Are you an academic oldernotwiser... I get the feeling that you think students are unimportant and aren't worthy of your time, do you have "much too important research to be getting on with"..... its all coming back to me now.

I think the point here is that academics are not 'teachers' and neither are they at the beck and call of students.

Students now think they are owed a degree simply because they have paid a small proportion of the full costs. That is the full cost of providing the services and facilities within a university, and also providing the many staff it takes to run it. That, of course, includes academic staff but as one of many. They are not 'buying' a substitute parent!

The lecturers deliver courses to students and grade their work, as a part of their overall role. HE students are adults and ultimately responsible for what they do with the information given to them. It is supposed to be the bare bones of a subject and the rest is up to the student.

What part of that do you not understand?

Students are not second class citizens because they are not centre of a lecturers universe! What a bizarre thought - we are talking about adults here!

This is an inevitable consequence of tuition fees and widening access imo.

Weak students no longer consider themselves out of their depth academically; now they consider themselves hard done by and worthy of compensation, simply because they have paid a fee.

Swirlywurly

Widening access doesn't necessarily mean weak. It isn't simply letting in people who academically aren't strong enough to be at uni. I got into university via a widening access scheme and work my !!!! off. I don't take anything for granted and I don't feel like i'm owed anything. I do very well academically and have done since I started.

Oldernotwiser

MORPH3US wrote: »

Nope, just repeating yourself hasn't explained what you meant... "total cost" of what - running the course or running the whole University. I still fail to see what relevance this has to anything?

And it doesn't matter one bit that teaching undergraduates is not the only or most important part of a university.... does that make them second class citizens, should Uni's say "we don't care about you, you're not as important as X or Y"

Your posts are very strange

I don't work in a University any more, my brain couldn't handle working in the little University bubble any longer... and definately not an academic, that lot are on a different planet.. clever, maybe... real world, not a chance.

Are you an academic oldernotwiser... I get the feeling that you think students are unimportant and aren't worthy of your time, do you have "much too important research to be getting on with"..... its all coming back to me now.

Sorry, I can't put it any more simply than I have done, so I'm sorry you don't understand me.

And no, I'm not an academic but, unlike you, I do understand what universities are actually about and, as I said, they are not just schools for grown ups. Universities should be academic communities with undergraduates and academic staff both learning at their different levels, with the more advanced enabling those who are on the earlier part of their journey.

If I were an academic I could think of nothing more soul destroying than working alongside young people who have no love of learning and who see universities as "degree factories" and themselves as "customers" who should be given value for money because a contribution has been made towards their costs. It's hardly surprising that academic staff son't respond more positively considering what they have to put up with these days; it's hardly the job they expected when they started down that road themselves.

MORPH3US

I'm amazed....

How can expecting lecturers to a) respond to an e-mail query in a reasonable time period and b) expecting lecturers to turn up to lectures be classed as "students thinking they are owed a degree"

Bestpud and oldernotwiser you have obviously read more into posts than you should have because no one on this thread has said they expect to have their hand held and be spoon fed... go back and read the thread again if you need to see that....

Whether the Universities make less money from undergraduates is irrelevant... the fact is that without under grads they possibly wouldn't be in a job. We all have crap parts of our job that we don't enjoy, but we have to put up with them to be able to do the good bits.

melancholly

MORPH3US wrote: »

I'm amazed....

equally, if a lecturer is snowed under at work and takes longer than they hoped to reply to an email, it is entirely inappropriate to mouth off in writing about how unfair it all is (sounding like kevin and perry!). it's pretty bad behaviour from both sides....

there is also a very clear comment (not from the OP) about how someone is paying thousands of pounds to be taught by lecturers - well clearly the money is going to the wider university for facilities too and that is the post that caused a negative reaction (which seemed reasonable to me!).

as far as the OP goes, i think they need to contact the Head of Undergraduate Affairs and speak to the module leader and see what they can do - however, it would seem prudent to remove the attitude. these things may be best dealt with in person with the opportunity to respond at the time (without losing your temper).

it's a tough one - if every other student could make the hand in, then it is difficult. someone who can't get in therefore gets more time to prepare, which is unfair. equally, this isn't a 'standard' excuse and it may make sense to try and find reports of cancelled public transport/impassable roads etc to make it clear that you're not just being opportunistic about some weather to get more time.

Piggles12345

MORPH3US wrote: »

I don't work in a University any more, my brain couldn't handle working in the little University bubble any longer... and definately not an academic, that lot are on a different planet.. clever, maybe... real world, not a chance.

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: Desmond anyone...?