UPDATED: Air Source Heat Pumps/Air Con - Full Info & Guide, is it cheaper to run than mains gas?

rhubarbe

Ours doesn't, Cardew. We may have our temp set too high but it heats the house just about as quickly as our LPG boiler ever did.

And sure, in an ideal world we'd all have underfloor heating but in the real world it's not practical for the 99% of houses that have existing radiators.

But hey, I'm saving a significant amount of money and because of that we're warmer than we have even been in 22 years in this house.

albyota

Cardew wrote: »

I would certainly agree that it simply makes no sense to try and specify a system that will cope with the 1% of days when the temp stays at, say, -5c all day. Just spend a few pounds on a couple of 3 kW fan heaters.

On the other hand you must not forget that heat pumps are at their most efficient with low water temperatures - which is where underfloor heating comes into its own.

Also bear in mind that with low temperature water in Rads/underfloor heating it takes much longer to bring a property up to a reasonable temperature than a conventional gas/oil CH system with the water heated to 80C+.

Spot on cardew, however, if the house is very well insulated, it is more efficient for a heat pump to be left on, (while the house is occupied) and use programmable room thermostat control to setback the temperature when you are out. The good thing with Mitsi Ecodan is the outdoor weather compensation sensor which automatically alters the flow temperature to the rads/UFH. Also calculating the size of the radiators is very important.

rhubarbe

"The good thing with Mitsi Ecodan is the outdoor weather compensation sensor which automatically alters the flow temperature to the rads/UFH."

Does it? I'll take your word for it but how can I demonstrate it to myself?

albyota

rhubarbe wrote: »

"The good thing with Mitsi Ecodan is the outdoor weather compensation sensor which automatically alters the flow temperature to the rads/UFH."

Does it? I'll take your word for it but how can I demonstrate it to myself?

It is the ECO setting (ECO/BOOST Switch), this can be adjusted by accessing the settings Via the menu of the Mitsi controller...it is the curve inclination graph, (not for the faint hearted).:eek:

rhubarbe

I've not yet plucked up the courage to deal with that controller. It's installed in a posiition that would induce claustrophobia in a candle-equipped Cornish tin miner.

albyota

rhubarbe wrote: »

I've not yet plucked up the courage to deal with that controller. It's installed in a posiition that would induce claustrophobia in a candle-equipped Cornish tin miner.

Bloody engineers eh!!

rhubarbe

I've been happy to bask in the reflected glory of the electricity consumption being much lower than last year and receiving the metaphorical pat on the head from the wife..

One day I'll brave it..

albyota

Here is a list of the air to water air source heat pump manufacturers so far, the list is in no particular order.

Information on the systems that have MCS (Microgeneration Certification Sceme) approval can be found here,

The RHI (Renewable Heat Incentive) is to set go ahead from June 2011* details of which can be found here and the consultation document here.

*to be confirmed Dec/Jan

Permitted development/Planning permission is expected to be announced around the end of November 2010, link to the planning Portal here.

• Mitsubishi Ecodan
• Daikin Altherma
• Sanyo ECO
• CTC Ecoair
• LG Therma V
• Panasonic Aquarea
• Toshiba Estia
• Samsung EHS
• Fujitsu Waterstage
• Nibe Fighter
• Calorex Heatseeker AW 9000
• TEV Heatking Bwarm
• Worcester bosch Greensource
• Vaillant Glow-worm Clearly Heat Pump
• Dimplex LA series K,M,10M,MS,AS,TU,PS,HS
• Danfoss DHP A/AL / Opti DHP AX
• IVT Optima
• ICS De Longi Climaventa - Bran H
• Glow Worm Clearly Heat pump by Vaillant
• Grant Aerona
• Hitachi Yutaki / Aquafree
• Vokera Aria
• Veissman Vitocal 350-A
• Trianco Activair - company gone into liquidation
• NuHeat / Nibe Model 2005
• Thermia Atria / Atria Duo
• Baxi Ambiflow
• Steibel Eltron WPL 10 ACS
• Heat and Save AQUALTHERMA TRIAQUA, Eco Warrior
• EcoAirPump EAP10.5-XS / 13XS / 18DS
• Keston AirGen

StuHolmes

StuHolmes wrote: »

Just got myself a renovation project with no gas supply. Considering air to water for DHW and UFH on ground floor and possibly air to air upstairs to also give cooling in summer. But don't know where to start really.

Anybody heard of either of these companies?

http://www.heatpumpinstallations.com/
http://www.spaceair.co.uk/

Any opinions gratefully received.

Just mentioned this to my builder and he says he does not recommend wet UFH as it is slow to respond and buried so far in the ground that is not efficient. He says use Speedheat electric UFH instead and that it has low running costs. Now he is clearly more experienced in these things and has greater knowledge than me, but I find this hard to accept. My impression was that electric UFH was hideously expensive to run.

albyota

Hi StuHolmes, you are right to find it hard to accept that electric UFH is less expensive to run, your builder obviously has not fitted Wet UFH and if he has, he fitted it incorrectly. Wet underfloor heating (using 15mm PEX barrier pipe installed at 100-150mm centres) is absolutely the best way to go, more efficient at lower temperature water flow and with an air to water heat pump is the best you can get (off gas grid). air to air is great for heating and cooling, probably the best combination of heating/cooling IMO, However, without radiators upstairs, you will need to design in an area where clothes/ towels can be dried, i.e towel rails in bathrooms. Spaceair are mainly distributors of Daikin air con units and the Altherma, not sure about heatpumpinstallations, but they are on the MCS list of accredited installers.