NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

OldJohn

Dr._Who wrote: »

:mad:I no longer intend to contribute to this forum or even to view it in light of the unreasonable things that are being said about our Ministers - enough said!!

It would be unfortunate if your opinions and insight were lost from this forum!

Toastandbutter

Dr Who - stay with it.
People are very angry and frustrated - but allow them their say. Some of it may be justified and it may help their health to speak freely at this point.

Perhaps with a happy ending they may find it to forgive those they feel wronged them.

I also agree with Old John about paying the administrator - what is the alternative??? Seriously now?? A Board of volunteers?

Err didnt we try that before?

I also understand he is fairly cheap but no less professional.

T&B

HOPE

OldJohn is talking common sense. Also Dr Who has contributed a lot to this forum and it would be a shame if he felt that he could not continue. However, I understand fully how he feels. Ministers and their families and many of them are seriously affected and are as distressed and worried as we are. I appreciate there is frustration and anger but blaming Ministers, Directors, PCI and others is not helping anyone at this time. We are were we are and we have to deal with it as best we can. Wait until at least we know the full facts and this debacle has been settled before pointing the finger. We need to remain calm, focused and constructive. Yes it is taking longer than we would have wished but at least it is being finally taken seriously and we have a chance of success. It is not all negative. If you want to do something positive lobby HM Treasury who are at last involved and they are the people that will decide our fate. Betrayed has already posted details. Remember we are in a better place today than a year ago and certainly a few months ago.

D.A.

BETRAYED wrote: »

Most have a month of annual holidays.

Err, I think you'll find that most jobs nowadays have *at least* 20 days (i.e. 4 weeks) of annual leave, if not more.

BETRAYED

PCI AND ARTHUR BOYD COULD GET ENOUGH CREDITORS IF THEY TRIED TO RETAIN ENOUGH SAVINGS IN ,IF NECESSARY A SEPERATE COMPANY, TO ALLOW PROPERTY VALUES TO RECOVER. CHURCHES HAVE 40M THERE. THEY COULD BE ASKED TO DELAY MAJOR BUILDING PROJECTS FOR 2 OR 3 YEARS SO AS THE POOR AND NEEDY GET ACCESS TO THEIR SAVINGS.
BOYD HAS Circa 30M IN BANK AT MOMENT AND THERE IS AN INCOME FROM INTEREST AND LOAN REPAYMENTS STILL COMMING IN.
A LOAN COULD ALSO HAVE BEEN TAKEN OUT AGAINST THE COMMERCIAL PROPERTY OWNED BY PMS

OH NO CHURCH DIDN''T WANT TO GET INVOLVED . . IT NOW APPEARS AFTER HEARING SAMMY WILSON THAT ALL OF US WHO ON THE ADVICE OF THE ADMINISTRATOR LOBBIED FOR HELP FROM GORDON BROWN AND THE TREASURY WERE FLOGGING A DEAD HORSE.
If A BANK TAKEOVER WAS THE PREFERRED OPTION THE ADMINISTRATOR WAS THE PERSON TO NEGOTIATE THAT.
NOW WE ARE TOLD ULSTER BANK (RBS) CAN NOT HELP OUT AND SAMMY WILSON SATES THAT PMS HAS 'GOT TO COMPETE' WITH OTHER ATTRACTIVE INVESTMENT PROPOSITIONS THAT OTHER BANKS ARE LOOKING AT NOW AS A RESULT OF THE BREAK-UP OF OTHER BIG BANKS.

joylikes2shop

NEWSLETTER
http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Wilson-tells-of-problems-in.5838859.jp


BELFAST TELEGRAPH....some comments have been added at end of article
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/hope-for-presbyterian-mutual-society-savers-as-potential-buyers-emerge-14566593.html

Royalmail_2

I've been monitoring this forum for awhile with limited interest. I've not had the nerve to make a post as I had to go through a registering process.
But it seems to me as a bit of an outsider that lots of people seem to have problems with the church that are not even PMS related. I thought the church was meant to be a happy place, but it seems there are more problems than the PMS within presbyterian church and it doesn't seem to be very united as such an organisation should be.

Dr._Who_2

Sorry folks but I happen to be a Minister who had to take out a substantial loan to proceed with the purchase of a property for retirement because my money is "frozen" in the PMS - I have a few years yet before it becomes difficult.
I can take you to the homes of retired Ministers where there is real anxiety about the future because savings are locked away in the PMS. Don't forget, these are people who, like myself, have been in homes where there has been illness/bereavement at all hours of the night - I have got out of my bed to go to someone's home before now. Your GP WON'T do that any longer - is the ministry the last calling left. It's a hard one sometimes - but there you go!!

Now what about these Church Committees with Treasurers "in the know" who were lining up to lift their money because they heard/listened to rumours. Some Churches didn't - but others contributed to the run - why not ask your church treasurer what they did?

By the way - ministers are saying nothing because many of us realise the shameful situation PCI has got itself into and are trying not to inflame the situation even more. :mad:
One poster is quite right - PCI has credibilty/integrity problems that go beyond PMS - and, yes, Church isn't always "sweetness and light", sadly!!

expat68

jon_groovy wrote: »

Have the directors not made enough of a shambles of things already ?

Why won't they cooperate ?

Not good news at all


http://u.tv/News/PMS-directors-in-High-Court-bid/14e11cee-0ed3-4f35-9b47-30b989ca97d5

The two mentioned are chartered accountants (one of them retired) so they would have been bound by the ethical requirements of their professional body. Maybe the PCI will be doing something similar with the ministers who were directors - or maybe not!

goodbyepci

Two Presbyterian Mutual Society directors launch bid to delay investigation

Saturday, 21 November 2009

Two directors at the collapsed Presbyterian Mutual Society have launched a High Court bid to delay an investigation by their professional disciplinary body.
Philip Black and David Clements are seeking to postpone attempts to interview them as part of attempts to establish if there was any potential misconduct in how the stricken mutual society was run. A judge was told neither man wants to participate in the inquiry by the Accountancy and Actuarial Discipline Board (AADB) while there is a prospect of separate proceedings.
The court heard an administrator's report prepared for the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Investment may lead to a directors' disqualification process taking place.
Lawyers for the two accountants said they could also become involved in any regulatory action taken by the Financial Services Authority or civil litigation by savers.
Up to 10,000 Presbyterians across Northern Ireland lost their savings when the Society went into administration a year ago following a run on its funds.
Barrister Tony McGleenan, for Mr Black and Mr Clements, acknowledged that in the context of its collapse the administrator's report was likely to make reference to them.
“It's almost inevitable. The public interest is fully served by state scrutiny of their conduct,” he told a judicial review hearing. He told the court a directors' disqualification process was live, with the Department having to decide whether it was in the public interest to make any order against his clients.
But a barrister representing the AADB insisted the only proceedings currently underway were those initiated by the disciplinary body.
“All that's happened is that Mr Black and Mr Clements have been invited for interview and they have refused,” he said.
“When one asks oneself the question is there a real risk of prejudice unless a stay is granted the answer at the moment must be no.”




Read more: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/two-presbyterian-mutual-society-directors-launch-bid-to-delay-investigation-14570987.html#ixzz0XU3x34XI