Are we as a society basically broken?

avinabacca

mewbie wrote: »

At least we know which side of the fence we both stand on.

I'm glad you do. I have absolutely no idea what you're trying to say here.

Phirefly

hethmar wrote: »

I did voluntary work for 5 years Phire, helping train diseffected young people. Young people, had you seen them in a group in the street, you would have crossed the road and avoided eye contact. One to one, when they dont have to show bravado in front of their peers, they come across as lost, confused and frightened.

If people are interested in helping the young diseffected, contact your local Youth workers or NCH - you can be mentors, trainers, or just befrienders to kids who have often never had a stable relationship with an adult in their lives. And the majority of them DO want to get on, have a good job, a stable relationship but they have no guidance in doing this.

Good post. It can be dismissed as touchy feely utopianism, but I think perhaps a difference really can be made to these people and in turn society will have less disaffected individuals causing everyone else grief.

Back to the original thrust of this thread though, how it links to economics, will we see a drop in this kind of work due to financial pressures? I for one was considering becoming involved in volunteer work earlier in the year, but have had to devote more time to my business that I anticipated due to the economic climate so feel I have less time to spare on more philanthorpic pursuits...

hethmar

No I think there are vast untapped resources out there for all sorts of vollie work. May be more information needs to be available to the public. Retired people could make excellent mentors for youngsters.

mewbie_2

avinabacca wrote: »

I'm glad you do. I have absolutely no idea what you're trying to say here.

Then let me spell it out. Again.

I don't like racism, it is possibly on the top of my "things I don't like" list. I am very sensitive to what I perceive to be racism in any form, from the outright BNP style, to the more insidious, and therefore arguably more dangerous, reasonable sounding racism. Along the lines of "it's not PC but we need to discuss it".

The Norfolk area has 'suffered' from a large of amount of immigration and tensions are running high. The danger of 'discussion' is that those who enjoy a little bit of minority bashing on a Saturday night feel their actions are more justified. Perhaps they could have applied for job picking cabbages on the local farm themselves, but I guess its beneath them.

In a disintegrating economy it is human nature to look for someone else to blame, so it is likely that racism and attacks on minorities will increase. This will be fuelled by those who always had an agenda to send the immigrants, and their third/fourth generation children home, but have been kept in check by the fact that most people keep their racism to themselves these days.

Well done MSE, you finally found my weak point, the one issue that I can't find it in me to do rubbish jokes about.

Is that clear enough? I can do pages of this, but it is a bit boring and pointless. People believe what they believe, nothing is going to change that.

hethmar

So its racism if we comment on the behaviour of groups of unruly outsiders but not if we comment on our home grown ones? Its by ignoring problems that we fuel them.

By the way, there is very little cabbage picking on farms - its all mechanical nowdays (though Ive done that and strawberry picking in the past) - I was speaking to a lady (herself a newcomer) who works with groups of immigrants.. She, herself, said that she despaired that many newcomers will do the minimum term working in a factory and then ask about the social benefits they can claim. We are not getting cheap labour who will happily spend the rest of the lives plucking chickens at Bernard Matthews. The majority are savvy enough to work the system and quickly decide they dont want the menial jobs either - and who can blame them. And clearly I could say the same for many local people.

One of the biggest problems to this becoming a safer secure country is the pc brigade who want to bury their heads and not face up to the problems, imported and homegrown, and sort them out.

I am not racist - like the saying goes, I have friends and family from all countries, races and walks of life - I think its much more dangerous to ignore all problems for the sake of being liberal and pc.

mewbie_2

Well, if you're going to create endless anecdotals without links to make your point then here is one of my own.

Employing Lithuanians, etc. is an eye opener in terms of quality. They are better educated, harder working, more willing than their British counterparts. They are decent young people, making some money for a couple of years before they return home which is actually where they really want to be.

At least they seem to have cottoned on to it being a Global economy - where people from all around the world will travel, and work, and stay, or move - contributing a rich mix of human diversity.

I guess its OK for inbred morons from the UK to buy up Lithuanian cottages and price the locals out of their houses. But not for them to choose to come and work over here.

hethmar

How on earth can you generalise like that? It does show you are indeed biased.

"Inbred morons" - is that how you see the British - wow, good job you dont say that about any other group.

My anecdotes are not "created" but come from experience - from having to rush to hospital to see my son with broken ribs and a face like a black balloon because he objected to some foreigners assaulting his girlfriend - to mixing with many social workers in the area as part of my voluntary work.

So I guess you must employ a lot of east europeans then who have proved their value over decades if you can state the above. And I guess the piles of rubble that Brits stupidly buy in these countries are really des res to the locals? You are joking - they probably rub their hands together when they see Mr and Mrs Brit dolling out money for rubbish they would never think of renovating.

And as for having the grit to move round the world, I think we are currently seeing about the same amount of Brits moving out of the country as the number of East Europeans moving in, arent we?

mewbie_2

Ok then.

I have argued my point - anti racist, and my solution - get on with it and stop blaming others for your misfortune.

What's your point, and what's your solution?

dad-of-4

dannyboycey wrote: »

Yes... we are broken. Why? ....Thatcher.

This country will never recover from her legacy.

i think your probably right, i think a willfull effort has been made to dismantly society to the sum of its parts, so we would never see mass protest and the people hitting the streets to force change making the governments back down.

its odd that back then the people of this country could strike and bring the country to its knees, the public could protest and get the poll tax abolished, all just the power of unity & common purpose.

dont get me wrong, im nessasarily saying thats a good or bad thing, but its certainly good to have the power to force change.

thesedays we cant even get a few pence knocked of petrol prices, is it an unworthy cause? or have we become a society so wrapped up in our own lives & persuits that we just cant get it together to make change?

dannyboycey

mewbie wrote: »

They are better educated, harder working, more willing than their British counterparts.

As you are so anti-racist, I suggest you re-read your post because I find it pretty offensive personally.