Flight delay and cancellation compensation, Thomas Cook ONLY

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1397398400402403858

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  • lizard123
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    David_e wrote: »
    I see what you are trying to do and forewarned is forearmed. Having said that, to some extent you are playing them at their own game by arguing about the frequency of a particular fault.

    Para 26 of Wallentin says (my emphasis):

    "technical problems are covered by those exceptional circumstances to the extent that they stem from events which are not inherent in the normal exercise of the activity of the air carrier concerned and are beyond its actual control"

    That basically says, forget what the technical problem was, what matters is the event(s) that caused the problem. If it was wear and tear, unexpected failure (excluding reported manufacturing defect) or anything else that happens in the routine course of operating a aircraft it's not EC. It doesn't matter if it's a blocked toilet or a misaligned outboard turbo thrust flange valve bracket edge trailing flap aileron unit which only fails once every time Halley's comet comes round - it's not EC!


    Judge Platts in Huzar summarize the same point - and doesn't even make mention of what the fault was:

    "Against that background I am persuaded that in this case the cause of delay or cancellation was the need to resolve the technical problem which had been identified. That being the case, in my judgment it does not matter how the technical problem was identified. Whether it was identified by routine maintenance (as was the case in Wallentin) or as a result of a warning light during flight (as in the present case) seems to me to be irrelevant. Equally and for that very reason the fact that it was unexpected and unforeseeable is also irrelevant. The reality is that once a technical problem is identified it is inherent in the normal activity of the air carrier to have to resolve that technical problem. Further, the resolution of the problem, as was demonstrated in this case, is entirely within the control of the carrier."

    Whatever else you do, just make sure you don't lose sight of the law which supports your interpretation!

    Thank you. It is very easy to get drawn in isn't it. I'm getting nervous as it's the first time I've ever done anything like this but what you have said here has really helped. Thanks again.
  • JPears
    JPears Posts: 5,086 Forumite
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    TC customer relations - oxymoron? :D
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  • David_e
    David_e Posts: 1,498 Forumite
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    JPears wrote: »
    oxymoron?

    You're half right .... But there's more than one of them.
  • batman44
    batman44 Posts: 545 Forumite
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    I think it just helps really as it say to the judge you have completed your cause of action.

    I don't think this question has been answered yet....

    I know I cannot use Huzar V Jet2.com as case law but can I refer to sections of it in court?

    Thanks
    Check out Vaubans Flight Delay Guide, you will be glad you did....:):):)
    Thomas Cook Claim - Settled Monarch Claim - Settled
  • P_Doff
    P_Doff Posts: 76 Forumite
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    batman44 wrote: »
    I think it just helps really as it say to the judge you have completed your cause of action.

    I don't think this question has been answered yet....

    I know I cannot use Huzar V Jet2.com as case law but can I refer to sections of it in court?

    Thanks

    Too right you can.
  • Justnan
    Justnan Posts: 23 Forumite
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    I am currently completing an initial response to TC's defence statement.
    Although we have proof of being on the flights concerned (ie boarding passes, stamped passports) I am sure I have seen somewhere that according to the Montreal Convention it is up to the airline to prove that we were not on the flight(s). Is that correct or have I got it wrong? I cannot seem to find it, can anyone point me in the right direction? ( I know I have enough, but just want to cover as much as possible.) Thanks
  • Vauban
    Vauban Posts: 4,736 Forumite
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    I don't think that is true. But if you have the boarding passes, you have all the proof required, surely?
  • David_e
    David_e Posts: 1,498 Forumite
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    Justnan wrote: »
    I am sure I have seen somewhere that according to the Montreal Convention it is up to the airline to prove that we were not on the flight(s).

    Would that be an issue if you are claiming under Reg 261/2004?

    In fact, it's presumably just a UK law issue isn't it? So the civil law "balance of probabilities" test?
  • Justnan
    Justnan Posts: 23 Forumite
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    Thanks for responding, think I just wanted to stick the boot in a bit more to be honest! I am just returning the notice of proposed allocation form back to court, but as the claim is for four and for both outbound and inbound flights,(mexico) i want to avoid the court listing the matter for a pre-trials hearing if possible. Thought I would include an 'initial response' to the defence argument to assist the Court. (and avoid the cost of listing) thanks again
  • Notgoingaway
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    We are currently awaiting our court date for our flight delay tcx893 sanford to manchester 10th november 2012.I only found this forum after we had started court proceedings.after reading through this thread I would like to ask opinions on if we should have based our claim on denied boarding...
    We arrived at the airport at our correct time to check in to be told our aircraft was no longer available due to disruptions within the fleet.basically they would be sending two smaller aircraft in its place that would also need to re fuel in Canada on the way home.
    Both flights were later than the one we should have been on (15:40) the first one left at 18:15 and the second one at 20:15 .we were on the second one were we denied boarding? In total we arrived home 7 and half hours late.
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