NPower gas 'sculpting'

Cardew

DirectDebacle wrote: »

I will request a refund which I expect they will refuse. I will then give them 14 days to settle or take them to the small claims court. Putting a claim in deadlock is just another way of fobbing you off. I am not going to waste my time writing letters or making endless pointless phone calls. They owe me money and I want it back. If it was the other way round they would have no qualms about instructing debt collectors or getting bailifs in. If the court finds in my favour then it won't matter whether they admit liability or not, they will have been found to be liable. Then perhaps that will open the door for others. It is time something was done other than chatting to their customer service dept. Actions speak louder than words.

Excellent.

It is a fairly painless procedure for the small claims court.

I suspect they will try and pay you off, without admission of liability, so a precedent is not set.

Make sure you include all your costs if that happens.

Keep us informed.

DirectDebacle

colonelhall wrote: »

Direct Debacle,

I don't know how your allocation of units during that period was only 3500. I would have thought that everybody would have been allocated the same. From the end of April to the beginning of November, I was charged 4,100 units.

However, if the period you are looking at starts 1/4/07, then check the units from 1/11/07 to 1/4/08. Under their system, you should be charged a further 3200 units.

The percentage of 4572 per month is 19.3 per month during this period. which is 77.2%.

In spite of what some are saying, my information is that sculpting existed up to 1/5/07 and then again from 1/11/07.

Hi Colonel,

Npower are into you for some serious money. If from 30th April to 31st Oct you were charged 4100 units (almost a full year in six months) high rate then under their new regime the total units at high rate from 1/11/07/-31/03/08 come out at 3801 ish. Gives you a total so far of 7901 and you haven't even reached the end of April yet to complete your year. Based on my prices ( vary from region to region) at the new rates from 04/01/08 that would come to an overcharge of about £105 incl vat. No wonder they don't want to refund anyone. A few million of those would dent the profits wouldn't it.

Terrylw1

Cardew wrote: »

Excellent.

It is a fairly painless procedure for the small claims court.

I suspect they will try and pay you off, without admission of liability, so a precedent is not set.

Make sure you include all your costs if that happens.

Keep us informed.

Spot on Cardew.

I've worked at many a company (including utilities) that will upon receiving this, will pass it to their solicitors who will just say - "pay them off and shut them up".

Npower have press officers who do the same. You ring a newspaper, the newspaper gives the utility notice they will print, the utility contacts you and gives you you money plus lots of compo and even a bunch of flowers at times as well as a written apology!

Seen that before off Npower. Maybe thats worth a try?

I wonder whether any win in court could be passed on in someway as to attract media attention? That might kick them squarly up the rse.

Terrylw1

Just something else worth mentioning.

If they have restarted your year, make sure you get any duel fuel discounts. Those might work the same, putting your refund back!

colonelhall

I have finally received an e-mail from Npower. No apology, jus tthis:
"
Good Evening,

Thank you for your email.

The first 4572 kwhs used are charged at the higher rate during the year, this is then divide out over the months. If there is a price increase the 4572 will start again. The information below is how we calculate our gas bills.

Over the year we charge a maximum of 4572 KWhs on the high rate tariff. This is worked out in one of two ways.

If the whole bill period is prior to the 01/05/07 then it will be ‘sculpted’, meaning that the primary block will be charged at a percentage based on “Season Normal Consumption” data.

If the period of the whole bill is post 01/05/07 then it will be charged on a ‘flat rate’ profile. This means that 8.33% of the 4572 KWhs for every full month will be charged on the high rate tariff and the remaining KWhs would then be charged at the low rate tariff.

If the period of the bill overlaps 01/05/07 then prior to that date the bill will be charged at the ‘sculpted profile’, and after 01/05/07 it will be charged at the ‘flat profile’.

STEP 1 - Work out the KWH’s

Take number of units used and multiply by 2.83 (if an imperial meter which would have 4 dials), with a metric meter (this would have 5 dials) there is no need to do this. Then multiply by the Calorific Value and the Correction Factor and divide by 3.6 (round up to 1 decimal place) to give you the total KWhs charged on the bill.

(The values for Calorific Value and Correction Factor are found on your individual bills however if there are no figures available use 40.0 for the Calorific Value and 1.02264 for the Correction Factor)

STEP 2 - Work out the number of KWhs to be charged at the high and low Rate

SCULPTED PROFILE (Whole Bill Period before 01/05/07)

Prior to 01/05/07 the primary block should be charged at a percentage as shown in the table below. The remaining KWhs would then be charged on the low rate tariff.

Month Consumption Profile %
May 06 7.1
June 06 4.2
July 06 2.4
August 06 2.4
September 06 4.2
October 06 7.3
November 06 10.3
December 06 12.7
January 07 13.8
February 07 13.6
March 07 12.2
April 07 9.8
100%

1) To work out the 1st month % at the high rate, of the bill.

Take the number of days in the month minus start day of the bill and divide by the number of days in the month (round to 2 decimal places). Multiply by the percentage for that month and round to the nearest whole number. This equals the first months proportion of the annual threshold (4572).

2) To work out the middle months % at the high rate, of the bill.

Add the full percentage for each full month

3) To work out the last month % at the high rate, on the bill.

Take the last day of the bill and divide by the number of days in the last month (round to 2 decimal places). Multiply by the percentage for that month and round to the nearest whole number. This equals the last months proportion of the annual threshold (4572).

4) Calculating the total to be charged at the high rate

To get the total percentage to be charged at the high rate for the quarter, add the 3 or 4 months percentages together from steps 1-3.

Multiply the total percentage by 4572 (round up to a whole number) to get the KWhs charged at the high rate.

Example
Bill period = 15/01/07 to 14/04/07

Jan 15 - Jan 31 = 16/31 (bill day/days in month) x 13.8% = 7.1%
February = 13.6%
March = 12.2%
Apr 1 to Apr 14 = 14/30 (bill days/days in month) x 9.8% = 4.6%

Total charged at high rate for bill period = 37.5%
Therefore number of higher rate units = 37.5% x 4572 = 1714kWh


FLAT RATE PROFILE (Whole bill period after 01/05/07)

After 01/05/07 the primary block should be charged at the number of days in the bill period multiplied by 12.526 (=4572/365). The remaining KWhs would then be charged on the low rate tariff.
Example
Number of days in quarter = 91
Therefore number of high rate units = 91 x 12.526 = 1140kWh


COMBINATION OF SCULPTED AND FLAT RATE PROFILES (Bill period overlaps 01/05/07)

Prior to 01/05/07 the primary block is charged at a percentage as shown in the table below. After 01/05/07 we will charge 8.33% of the 4572 KWhs for every full month on the high rate tariff, and the remaining KWhs would be charged on the low rate tariff.

Month Consumption Profile % Month Consumption Profile %
May 06 7.1 May 07 8.33
June 06 4.2 June 07 8.33
July 06 2.4 July 07 8.33
August 06 2.4 August 07 8.33
September 06 4.2 September 07 8.33
October 06 7.3 October 07 8.33
November 06 10.3 November 07 19.33
December 06 12.7 December 07 19.33
January 07 13.8 January 08 19.33
February 07 13.6 February 08 19.33
March 07 12.2 March 08 5.94
April 07 9.8 April 08 5.93
May 08 1
June 08 1
July 08 1
August 08 1
September 08 1
October 08 5.93
November 08 19.3
December 08 19.3

1) To work out the 1st month % at the high rate, of the bill.

Take the number of days in the month minus start day of the bill and divide by the number of days in the month (round to 2 decimal places). Multiply by 8.33 (or by the percentage for that month if before 01/05/07(see table above)) and round to the nearest whole number. This equals the first months proportion of the annual threshold (4572).

2) To work out the middle months % at the high rate, of the bill.

Add the full percentage for each full month

3) To work out the last month % at the high rate, on the bill.

Take the last day of the bill and divide by the number of days in the last month (round to 2 decimal places). Multiply by 8.33 (or by the percentage for that month if before 01/05/07 (see table above)) and round to the nearest whole number. This equals the last months proportion of the annual threshold (4572).

4) Calculating the total to be charged at the high rate

To get the total percentage to be charged at the high rate for the quarter, add the 3 or 4 months percentages together from steps 1-3.

Multiply the total percentage by 4572 (round up to a whole number) to get the KWhs charged at the high rate.

Example
Bill period = 15/03/07 to 14/06/07

Mar 15 - Mar 31 = 16/31 (bill day/days in month) x 12.2% = 6.3%
April = 9.8%
March = 8.33%
Jun 1 to Jun 14 = 14/30 (bill days/days in month) x 8.33% = 3.9%

Total charged at high rate for bill period = 28.33%
Therefore number of high rate units = 28.33% x 4572 = 1294kWh


STEP 3 - Totalling the Bill

Take the total KWhs worked out in step 1 and subtract the KWhs charged at the high rate to get KWhs at the low rate.

Take KWhs on the high rate and multiply by the high pence per KWh, then divide by 100 to convert into pounds and pence.

Take KWhs on the low rate and multiply by the low pence per KWh, then divide by 100 to convert into pounds and pence.


Kind regards "

So that explains everything!

DirectDebacle

Hi Colonel. Thank you so much for that post. Of course it is absolute garbage and probably breaches every guideline Ofgem has put out on clear and understandable bills. Do you know when your year starts? Did powergen tell you. If not you haven't a cat in hells chance of even beginning to work out your bill and your chances don't improve much if they did. Bottom line is no matter how complex they make it it is stiil 4572 in a year so if you have paid more than that then just demand the overpayment be re-imbursed. I have written to them so will probably get a similar reply...or not, who knows with npower. The big one they slipped in right at the beginning and hope you have forgotten about after the mind olympics formula is the...'if there is a price increase the 4572 will start again.' This has to be questioned and as I understand it they restarted the 4572 on 1/11/07 when there was no price increase. The price increase for gas was on 05/01/08. But they have no right to re-start the year.
Wish I could be more helpful but my head is still spinning from your post. We only want to be able to work out our gas bills not the energy coefficient of rocket fuel in a zero gravity vacuum.

colonelhall

DirectDebacle,
Thank you for your support. Needless to say, I am not accepting this. The information they have given me, I already worked out for myself! In a previous post, I mentioned that I expected them to talk about the period before 1/5/07 and the period after 1/11/07.

They are correct in saying that for one year its is 4572, for six months it is 4572/2 and for the coming year it is 4572.

But the fact remains that for any 12 month period I have been charged a minimum of 4572 and over three years I have been charged an extra 1740

By talking about a 2 1/2 year period, they are ignoring the six months before, which, under this system, would be charged at the higher rate.

I am demanding a refund for the 1740

Cardew

NPower have raised obfuscation to an art form!

It is all to easy to get into a semantic discussion on their wording - which is probably their objective.

However I think they have shot themselves in the foot with this statement(to be found on the 5th line)

Over the year we charge a maximum of 4572 KWhs on the high rate tariff.

Obviously it is the summer period where they 'suspended' sculpting that creates the problem.

As I read it, the worse case scenario is for a billing year of March 2007 to February 2008(inclusive) Again as I read it from their figures the percentages you pay are:

March 2007 12.2%
April 9.8%
May 8.33%
June 8.33%
July 8.33%
Aug 8.33%
Sep 8.33%
Oct 8.33%
Nov 19.33%
Dec 19.33%
Jan 2008 19.33%
Feb 19.33%

Now if my arithmetic is correct that means they will charge 149.33% of 4,572 in a 12 month period i.e. for an extra 2,255 units at the primary rate - say £90?

The scale of this problem is huge, every customer with them over the period of their suspension of sculpting will have been overcharged - this is a scam of multi-million pound proportions.

DirectDebacle

Wholeheartedly agree with you Cardew and keep at 'em Colonel.Two points to raise with them are;

1. Re-setting the year. I don't beleive they have any right to do this.

2. A price rise triggers the re-set.

Does anyone know when the price rise was in November and how much it was. I was paying the same price for my gas all through 2007 up to 4th Jan 2008. Incidentally the price rise in Jan raised my high rate by 43% and the low rate by 3%. So those of you that got the 17% as advertised by npower were lucky.

Afterthought: Wouldn't it be nice to get one of those 'class action' lawyers to take this up to represent a few million of us. We'd get compensation, lawyer get a big fat fee and npower foot the bill and be made to clean their act up. Win, win, win I'd say.

c0113tt3

Hmm, Phone call from OFGEM, unusual to say the least, considering they dont reply to individuals, they confirmed that they are investigating NPOWER on several issues, and are aware of everything that has been going on and will come to a decision soon. I also made it clear that even with NPOWER's explanation, we still have paid more than the 4572 tier 1, and even though they did reduce the price of tier 2 from April 30th 2007 (according to Npower to try and alleviate any overpayment with tier 1, switching the gas sculpt off to assist in billing system migration) it still resulted in overpaying them !!

I would also like to correct any earlier statements I made on when the tier 1 is reset, originally I was informed verbally by executive complaints that it was just the gas sculpt being on / off, it is also the price changes too that resets it as well, as stated by a few people now. I now have all this in writing.