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NPower gas 'sculpting'
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I'm still trying to work out how we got such a high final bill (They said it was something to do with underestimates from previous billing but can't see how when they were fairly up to date with plenty of readings supplied by us).
Anyway, looking at this sculpting business, when I add up the units we were charged at the higher rate from 23/3/07 to 26/03/08 it comes to 6270 so suggests we have been over charged?
Just in case, if I look at 21/12/06 to 17/12/07 it comes to 5729 so alot depends on where the offcial year starts and ends (If there is an official year period?). What is also very unclear is how they split the quarterly figures as they seem to differ from quarter to quarter - there seems seems to be no pattern to follow or am I just too thick?
I can imagine there are a lot of unhappy NPower customers out there but because the billing is so all over the place that they don't bother to look into it as it's so difficult to relate to and to question them directly about it.0 -
Just had a call from energywatch in regard to all of this.
They are very aware of all the details that is happening, literally thousands of customers are complaining of it, and energywatch are continuously moving forward to deal with the matter as they feel it is an unfair practice. They admit though it may take several months and the best part of 2008 to push for a decision / resolution to it.
They also confirmed, a reply from npower, when energy watch initially questioned them, that npower feel it is an acceptable practice, which energywatch do not agree with !!
As for a right to claim back the overpayments, they could not comment, until a resolution / decision had been made, but people could go through small claims court etc..0 -
Hi, Thanks for the responses and comments. The point I was making seems to have been missed. Npower are telling you they have put the year back to zero and are charging another 4572 units from the zero date. Currently this is effective from 1/11/07. The reason for this is that they altered the % rate per month that they applied to the 4572. Seems to be one of several reasons they give. As I said it is 4572 for a year and a year is a year. Everybody needs to find out when their 'block year' starts. It may well be different for everybody. For myself I am treating my year as starting 1st April - 31st March. It was 1st April 2003 that npower changed from the old Standing Charge system to the two tier system. I was with them then and they have never notified me of anything different.
From 1st April 2007 to 31st March this year I have been charged over 6500 KWh at the high rate. The mathematics are inescapable. I am not interested in their waffle about migrating bills, sculpting percentages or price rises. These are all red herrings so don't follow them. I am requesting immediate refund of the overpayments and if they don't repay them then I will have no qualms about taking them to the small claims court. I am quite happy to let a court decide how long a year is. Think of it this way.The council tax is set in April and in May a new council gets elected. The new council decide on a higher council tax and that the council tax year now starts in June for the next year and what youv'e already paid in April and May doesn't count. I don't suppose there would be too many happy households and the Govt would soon step in. Ofgen will take a little longer.0 -
Hi, Yes from 1/11/07-31/03/08 have been billed over 3600 KWh at the high rate. Not on.0
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Just so you know, they completed their system migrations last year. Their gas migration was going on from summer.
They do not have 2 billing systems now, they have 1 for residential customers.
Also, you might want to question why they have moved electricity customers into the current system with tier 1/2 and this did not occur on them.
So, it either comes down to a) a moronic decision to attempt to scam gas customers but not electric or b) the system restarted your tier 1 from the date your MPRN moved systems.
Like I said, my money is on b) because when they moved all their elec customers, it reset their DD's to standard payments which the customer had agreed to change.
I could go on about other areas like that. Their bill estimation does something similiar. Why? The current system, the issues never existed in the previous system.
Await a public response from Energywatch.
Like I said, why reset Tier 1 on gas and not elec?
Also, if they an get away with this whenever, why point to system migration which ended last year?:rotfl: It's better to live 1 year as a tiger than a lifetime as a worm...but then, whoever heard of a wormskin rug!!!:rotfl:0 -
DirectDebacle wrote: »Hi, Thanks for the responses and comments. The point I was making seems to have been missed. Npower are telling you they have put the year back to zero and are charging another 4572 units from the zero date. Currently this is effective from 1/11/07. The reason for this is that they altered the % rate per month that they applied to the 4572. Seems to be one of several reasons they give. As I said it is 4572 for a year and a year is a year. Everybody needs to find out when their 'block year' starts. It may well be different for everybody.
It's as easy as you say...it's 4 quarters from your start date with them. The exception is general a part quarter bill at the start of your billing with them as sometimes utilities move forward to use the first full quarter onwards.
The fact remains, they migrated their gas system in mid 2007...then all this comes out.
Since Npower have already admitted that migrations have had the same effect on DD payments, it's very likely to be poor project management with a mix of lack of caring about customers.
I've worked on plenty of data migrations and these issues do occur but you get around them by apportioning on either side...not restarting.
Ofgem will spank them if thats all it is because they cut costs on their migration and stiffer their customers in the process.:rotfl: It's better to live 1 year as a tiger than a lifetime as a worm...but then, whoever heard of a wormskin rug!!!:rotfl:0 -
DirectDebacle.
You can make your request to be refunded from npower, but I can assure you, you will not get it !! Even if you take it as far as an executive complaint the answer will be the same, no !!. What you will get is the explanation and a final response letter, that puts the complaint into deadlock. This is what they are doing with everyone who complains / asks for refund. So its either wait for energywatch, will be a long wait, or try at a small claims court...0 -
Hello all,
Read this thread with interest, as I brought this up in a previous thread some months ago.
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=563638
Out of interest I also complained to npower and energywatch and after some time and repeated contacts received a cheque from npower for £40 as a compensation for the "my perception" of the overcharging of primary rate units.
My view is npower acted in a very amoral way here and have managed to collect a lot of extra money from customers who never check their bills. I hope energywatch does persue them and make them compensate all affected customers but I suspect it will never happen except for those who complain loudly and often!
I was lucky since I was so annoyed I switched (fortunately!) to southern electric's price fix 2008 just in time to grab the lower prices until this November. So far Southern Electric have been excellent to deal with
Interestingly 2 days ago I had a customer service guy from npower phoning me up asking why I left them!! I was slightly surprised but gave him a brief precis of the reasons. He apologised and promised to put a note on my file to prevent anyone else calling me.
Probably get another call next week then!0 -
You must have been quick off the mark and lucky PossetJohn, It is energywatch who confirmed to me that they are giving out final responses and putting the complaints into deadlock with the gas sculpt / over paying of tier 1 kwh. Npower confirmed to me that they couldnt refund because they would be admitting liability (which they believe they have not done anything wrong) and would have to refund everyone.. With it being publicised to some brief extent of detail on Watchdog, you now have thousands of people complaining, hence this given response from them now. Its good to know someone got some justice0
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DirectDebacle.
You can make your request to be refunded from npower, but I can assure you, you will not get it !! Even if you take it as far as an executive complaint the answer will be the same, no !!. What you will get is the explanation and a final response letter, that puts the complaint into deadlock. This is what they are doing with everyone who complains / asks for refund. So its either wait for energywatch, will be a long wait, or try at a small claims court...
I will request a refund which I expect they will refuse. I will then give them 14 days to settle or take them to the small claims court. Putting a claim in deadlock is just another way of fobbing you off. I am not going to waste my time writing letters or making endless pointless phone calls. They owe me money and I want it back. If it was the other way round they would have no qualms about instructing debt collectors or getting bailifs in. If the court finds in my favour then it won't matter whether they admit liability or not, they will have been found to be liable. Then perhaps that will open the door for others. It is time something was done other than chatting to their customer service dept. Actions speak louder than words.0
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