NPower gas 'sculpting'

colonelhall

Hi Cardrew,
"I suppose that they could argue that some people will pay for less than 4,572 per year average. "

I may have got this wrong, but from my experience, the lowest rate per month during the last year has been 4572/12 - this is during the Summer months, when they changed to an even distribution. Therefore, no-one can be charged less than 4572 for any period.

JohnG

Hi Jimbo,

Yes, I would certainly not bother to move to NPower to save £50 as you will probably end up losing out in the long run - I'm surprised you can't find a better saving through someone else as NPower currently appears to be one of the highest - but that's just a feeling I have following our recent experience with them.

Regarding the billing/calculations - I've got to say how complicated it appears to be, certainly with NPower, and it does make it extremely difficult to understand, but then maths has never been my strong point.
I really think all companies should be made to use a simpler system, ideally that is standard for all so we can compare like for like.
Eon seems easier to understand as we have a daily rate plus one rate per unit of energy.
Re price increases, I also feel we should be given something like a months notice of impending increases so that we consumers can decide whether to stay or look elsewhere before the new charges come into play. Certainly if I want to put my charges up I always notify my customers in writing and give a months notice before they are applied so they can look elsewhere if they so desire.
Trouble is these days, fairness and transparency rarely exists when it comes to big businesses (Not just with politicians ).

John

Cardew

colonelhall wrote: »

Hi Cardrew,
"I suppose that they could argue that some people will pay for less than 4,572 per year average. "

I may have got this wrong, but from my experience, the lowest rate per month during the last year has been 4572/12 - this is during the Summer months, when they changed to an even distribution. Therefore, no-one can be charged less than 4572 for any period.

They will be 'clutching at straws' to justify their scam, but what I was talking about is averaging over an 18 month period going forward from here. What I said was:

I suppose that they could argue that some people will pay for less than 4,572 per year average.
e.g. I join NPower in March. From March to Sept(6 months) I only pay, say, for 1,000kWh and then they 'reset' the sculpting and in the next 12 months I pay for 4572. So in 18 months I have only paid for 5,572kwh at the primary rate - an average of 3,714 per year.

If they changed to an 'even distribution' for the summer, then obviously that doesn't apply.

My biggest worry would be the argument that 'resetting the sculpting' at the time of a price change could be justified legally(but not of course morally) as it is a new tariff and you have the opportunity to leave the company.

However if, as indicated above by co113tt3, the resetting is not tied to a price change, then I can't see them wriggling out on that excuse.

I would just pass the details to Energywatch and get them to investigate.

roddydogs

s the "Sculpting" still used? thinking of changing to them, but can find no reference to it, it just quotes "Kw Hr" and suchlike.

colonelhall

I've just been in touch with energywatch and they tell me that they have dealt with this once before and that they received a reply from Npower stating that there is nothing that can be done.

c0113tt3

Thats probably the answer we all expected from npower, and ultimately it is with ofgem to do something about it. Other than that all we can all do, is make sure the true facts of this gas sculpting process is publicised.

colonelhall

All very dispiriting! It looks like all I can do is write to the media and switch my account.

Cardrew, I think that I see what you are saying. For the six month period that covers the Summer months, i was charged 51% at higher rate for 51% of the year. If only it were made that easy!

I notice that since then, I have been charged 3228 units at the higher rate, that is 30.3% of the year and 70.6% of the units. I can hang on in the hope that I now have only 1524 left over the next 255 days, but how will I know that they won't change it?

c0113tt3

colonelhall wrote: »

All very dispiriting! It looks like all I can do is write to the media and switch my account.

I notice that since then, I have been charged 3228 units at the higher rate, that is 30.3% of the year and 70.6% of the units. I can hang on in the hope that I now have only 1524 left over the next 255 days, but how will I know that they won't change it?

You will not even know until its too late and I very much doubt they will leave the current gas sculpt alone, the history has proven they stop and restart it, meaning you pay more than 4527 kwh tier 1 per year. This definately needs to get to the media !!

The facts are that you pay tier 1 for the rental / upkeep of the pipes etc.. leading to your home, as npower will pay transco, but I / we are overpaying that and npower are pocketing that extra, how can that ever be fair , correct and accurate? Never !!

Also with everything they have not informed us (sculpting prior to nov 07), and everything they have informed us (marketing info - sculpting nov 07, jan 08 price rises) Is all marketing bull***t How can you put trust in that?

None of the information supplied states thay have sculpted prior to Nov 07, none of the information states they switch it on / off / change it, none of the information states how i / we pay more tier 1 kwh by them doing it. Instead they state we will only pay upto 4527 kwh tier 1 !!!

They are not to be trusted and deploy very underhand procedures.

colonelhall

Cardrew, I think that I have cracked it, thanks to you and no thanks to Npower, who still haven't got back to me.

I've used gas sculpting figures that I have gleaned from this site. The set pre-May 2007, the set after November 2007 and the set between. I've applied them to a period dating from January 2006.

If you look at any 12 month period up to the first change, you will have paid 102.4% of the 4572 ( my monthly figures may be a bit out, so let's call it 100% )

The next six month period is a flat rate resulting in 50% of 4572, which is fair.

If you project the figures from November 2007 for 12 months, it is 100%. From then on, each 12 month stretch is 100%.

Damn! i may have just done their job for them and saved them 35 million quid!

Cardew

colonelhall wrote: »

I've just been in touch with energywatch and they tell me that they have dealt with this once before and that they received a reply from Npower stating that there is nothing that can be done.

I wonder if Energywatch realise you are talking about the same issue concerning 'sculpting'.

The original issue was the complaint to 'weight' the winter primary units.

That issue was addressed by Energywatch and NPower stated(with some justification) that sculpting affected very few people.

This is because the majority of us would use all the primary units in each and every one of the 12 months of the year.

So even though those who used very little gas in the Summer now paid more, nobody would pay for more than 4572 primary units.

However I wonder if Energywatch appreciate that there now is a more serious problem in that the 'resetting' of the sculpting(for whatever reason) will mean customers paying for more than 4572 primary units in a 12 month period.

My gut feeling is that Energywatch are not aware of the 'resetting' issue.