HELPED I've been duped (planning permission)

Debt_Free_Chick

Another very odd thing about the solicitor's process ...... any house purchase I've made and the solicitor gets a copy of the PP from the local authority.

In fact, there have been instances when a current seller did not even know about PP granted before they moved in! The solicitor gets details of all PP applications for that property/site using one of the LA searches. So did the solicitor do the search?

pickles_pink

HugoSP wrote: »

. They are obliged to go to reasonable efforts to ensure all is OK,quote]

This was the judgement of the law society

I don't think he got it in writing but I can't be 100% - being fair we did move completion forward a week which left only a fortnight to go so maybe he reushed (but that is not my fault)

I asked the solictors almost a year ago for a copy of every document on file they acknowledged my request and I've heard nothing sine. everything is such a battle!

ABN

Looking at it from a different angle

First it would seem that the builder did have planning permission for the OP’s flat.

There some questions the answers for which may shine some more light on the problem.

The OP brought the flat in 2005 some 2 years ago. At that time did the 13th flat exist. Perhaps, since it now seems to be owned by the builder, it didn’t or wasn’t declared.

Second question was the building signed off by the planners / building control and the extra 3 meters was un-noticed. Was this extra 3 meters only found out about when the “nutter” raised the objection.

According what to the answers are perhaps the solicitor would not, nor could not have any knowledge short of going to the property with the plans and taking dsetailed measurements and physically counting the flats.

slipp_digby

Debt_Free_Chick wrote: »

Re the financial loss .... if PP is granted, then it's you won't suffer any financial loss on that point.

Personally - I would wait for the outcome of the PP application. If successful (and I think it will be), then follow the solicitor's complaints procedure and try to get an "ex-gratia" award for distress & inconvenience. How much would feel right? £100? £200?

I agree with this, legal action should be pursued if you suffer financial loss and if PP isnt forthcoming this flat is worth about three jelly beans.

I just re-read this thread from the begining. As this is in the category of "most serious" complaints, I personally would tell them that I want every last penny back for the distress their negligence has caused. The potential magnitude of the loss could have been catestrophic.

Wonder what your lender thinks of your solicitor. Probably wants to insert a pineapple up has back pipe without any lubricant

PasturesNew

slipp_digby wrote: »

Wonder what your lender thinks of your solicitor. Probably wants to insert a pineapple up has back pipe without any lubricant

Brilliant. I bet the lenders don't see many of these type of problems.

ken_and_dot

There was planning permission granted for the development and the solicitor should/would have inspected this. The permission would have been based on the plans submitted with the planning application. The issue with the 13th flat is another matter. The completion certificate would be issued by building control to the effect that the development was constructed in accordance with current building regulations. This certificate would be based on plans submitted to building control and more than likely would not be the same as those submitted for planning premission. They would contain far more detail of the construction process. When I was involved in development I always used two sets of plans. The first set contained only details required for planning, the second , more detailed set were for building control. The second set were only produced after planning permission was granted and, had I chosen too, could have differed significantly from the first set. No one would have picked up on this.

So the outcome is that the solicitor asks to see planning approval and building completion approval. He sees the certificates not the plans. It is unlikely that during this process he would pick up on the fact that the two certificates relate to different plans. The developers solicitor could also be duped by this if the developer chooses to mislead him.

Go to the council and ask to see copies of the plans submitted for planning approval and for building control approval. See if they differ in substance. If the 13th flat is not shown on the building control plans then the local authority negligently issued a completion certificate. If the 13th flat is shown on the building control plans then the developer has been fraudulent. The fact that he possibly owns the 13th flat would seem to support this.

HugoSP

pickles_pink wrote: »

HugoSP wrote: »

. They are obliged to go to reasonable efforts to ensure all is OK,quote]

This was the judgement of the law society

I don't think he got it in writing but I can't be 100% - being fair we did move completion forward a week which left only a fortnight to go so maybe he reushed (but that is not my fault)

I asked the solictors almost a year ago for a copy of every document on file they acknowledged my request and I've heard nothing sine. everything is such a battle!

If they haven't got the statement in writing then they are muppets, as they have no defence whatsoever in a negligence case. Their Professional Indemnity insurers may as well just hand you a cheque for the full purchase price/current market value (if it had correct PP) of the property plus any costs associated with surrendering your mortgage, moving, renting in the meantime, heartache etc etc etc. Their PI insurance would know this and they may not contest a claim but try to mitigate it. The solicitors could be struck off.

If they have got a statement in writing then liability may be shifted onto the solicitors acting for the developer - solicitors are not supposed to mislead and they could be struck off for this.

silvercar

I think ken_and_dot is spot on.

One house we owned years ago had had an extension before we bought it. Before we sold the lender sent us loads of paperwork I had not previously seen. Along with the letter of planning permission and the building regs certificate were the plans, they bore no relation to what was actually built so I binned the plans but passed the PP and building regs letters to my solicitor.

Rabiddog_2

In regards to the person creating delay ,, they probably think that there might is something in it for them .. eg You are desperate to sell your flat (after only two years?) so maybe this person thinks you might want to offload it at a bargain price. Two flats in one block is nice and easy to administer and look after. or maybe they are just a member of the awkward squad.

ken_and_dot

Regarding my earlier post above in respect of plans for planning permission and building control. One aspect not mentioned so far is that it may not necessarily have been the council who issued the completion certificate. With a development this size it is likely that the developer used the NHBC or Zurich in order to obtain the buyer's ten year guarantee. If this is the case the council's building inspectors would not be involved at all. However, my point about two sets of plans would still be valid. Ask your solicitor who issued the completion certificate. With a new build, assuming you have a mortgage, then the Council of Mortgage Lenders would require a completion certificate from the NHBC or similar (not the local council) before they would grant the mortgage so on reflection it is quite possible the council building inspectors were not involved. However, the existence of planning and completion certificates would seem to absolve your solicitors from some of the blame if you accept that they cannot be expected to study two lots of complicated plans which they are not qualified to do.