New HL fee structure from 01/03/26

masonic

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81864619#Comment_81864619

I noticed a huge improvement when I stopped holding OEICs/UTs and opted for exchange traded investments. Nowadays it isn't economically viable for me to hold the former with the higher platform fees in so many places. It does also sidestep the complexities of unit conversions. But I agree, anyone who ends up in a worse position due to being out of the market unnecessarily during a transfer ought to complain. Though some might get lucky, transfer during a stockmarket correction, and ultimately end up better off as a result. So a platform failing in this regard can be a win-win for the investor.

GeoffTF

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81864693#Comment_81864693

Being out of the market during a transfer does not make much sense to me. Selling and buying an equivalent investment that is available on both platforms before the transfer would make more sense. Nonetheless, there will be people who believe that the fund they are holding has the unique ability to make them rich.

masonic

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81864975#Comment_81864975

But being out of the market in this scenario carries zero risk and the potential for a positive outcome.

Say you have £50k invested in ACME Global Equity Class S at 50,000 units. Your new platform only carries Class P units and is unable to convince the fund manager to convert it during the transfer. You are therefore told that to progress the transfer you will have to transfer this holding in cash. You proceed under protest, as you have not been provided with another way forward.

Scenario 1: During the transfer global equities correct by 10%. When the cash is received in the new platform you can buy 54,000 units of ACME Global Equity Class P worth £50k, whereas 50,000 units of ACME Global Equity Class S is now worth only £45k - you have made £5k profit owing to the cash transfer.

Scenario 2: During the transfer, global equities soar on positive economic data. When the cash is received in the new platform you can only buy 46,000 units of ACME Global Equity Class P worth £45k, whereas 50,000 units of ACME Global Equity Class S is now worth £55k - you have made a £5k loss owing to the cash transfer… so you raise a formal complaint about not being offered the option to convert your units and demand a cash payment of £5k plus £100 for distress and inconvenience. The provider has no option but to uphold your complaint and pay you off, or let it pass to the FOS who will surely decide in your favour and probably levy a case fee on the provider.

You have effectively been offered the opportunity to take a bet on the market with any losses refunded.

Whereas if you choose to manually sell and buy another equivalent fund, say E-Corp Global Equity Class B, prior to initiating the transfer, you will potentially incur non-refundable dealing charges, swing-pricing/spread, a day out of the market, and may feel the need to switch again when the transfer completes. You will be potentially be worse off than in either of the two scenarios above.

GeoffTF

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81865061#Comment_81865061

That is fair enough unless the FOS decides that you consented to the cash transfer. It would be safer to raise a formal complaint with whichever party refuses to arrange for the unit class switch (or both of them). You have then mitigated your loss, and should succeed with a claim for any additional fees.

granta

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81865131#Comment_81865131

I guess it all depends on the terms and conditions of the broker who refuses to do the conversion. I always ask to transfer in specie but there is always a caveat in the tick box that a part cash transfer may be necessary if conversion isn't possible. So I can't see how FOS would find in your favour there.

I usually tick a box to ask for that asset to be left behind if it can't be transferred in specie.

GeoffTF

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81865374#Comment_81865374

The point is that the FCA does not seem to accept that conversion is ever impossible. The rules say that it has to happen. You are right to tick the box to say the asset must be left behind if it cannot be transferred in specie, but you should make a formal complaint if it is left behind. The Ombudsman should rule that the broker must make the conversion and complete an in specie transfer, or state publicly why it cannot be done in their decision, which should be a wake up call for the FCA.

granta

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81865441#Comment_81865441

Thanks, I didn't know any of that

EthicsGradient

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81862279#Comment_81862279

That's … slightly … better than the time it took for my in specie (all shares or ETFs) transfer from AJ Bell to ii, a couple of years ago. That took 12 weeks. I worked out they could have sent the communications between Manchester and Leeds by walking, and still done it faster. They blamed each other for the delays.

GeoffTF

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81865566#Comment_81865566

Walk from Leeds to Manchester: 4 days by a scenic route:

How to Walk From Leeds to Manchester in Four Days

rob_hants

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81863796#Comment_81863796

I only have one fund to transfer, but II contacted me today (on a Sunday!) asking if I was happy for them to convert the class. The ongoing charge is higher than the discounted version I hold with HL, but only by 0.44%. As I've been paying HL 0.45% in fees it's basically the same overall cost.

Nothing else in my portfolio caused an issue and they were happy to accept all the bonds and shares I had.