New cooker couldn't be connected - refund?

Upsidedownyouturnme

My poor (very elderly) mum has been dragged into a mess that is stressing her out.

My sibling needed a new oven and got my mum to pay for it on mum's credit card, and she gave mum cash for the oven.

My sibling also paid for a connection fee from the retailer, this was also paid on mum's card, but she hasn't received the money for that.

The oven was disconnected by sibling's partner (who has also wired in previous, second-hand, cookers).

The new oven was delivered but the electricians refused to wire it in, as she has no trip switch on her consumer box.

Mum is desperately trying to contact Argos to get a refund for the connection fee as sibling has told her that AO said she is entitled to one.  Argos are only offering a small discount.

Unfortunately as it was mum's credit card that paid for it, then mum says it's her who has the contract and has to sort it out, although it went to sibling's house,

Not sure what is going to happen re the electrics, guess sibling will have to pay, if she doesn't want her partner to do it.

The question is - is there a reason to expect the full installation to be refunded as the installation wasn't possible?

born_again

Upsidedownyouturnme said:

My poor (very elderly) mum has been dragged into a mess that is stressing her out.

My sibling needed a new oven and got my mum to pay for it on mum's credit card, and she gave mum cash for the oven.

My sibling also paid for a connection fee from the retailer, this was also paid on mum's card, but she hasn't received the money for that.

The oven was disconnected by sibling's partner (who has also wired in previous, second-hand, cookers).

The new oven was delivered but the electricians refused to wire it in, as she has no trip switch on her consumer box.

Mum is desperately trying to contact Argos to get a refund for the connection fee as sibling has told her that AO said she is entitled to one.  Argos are only offering a small discount.

Unfortunately as it was mum's credit card that paid for it, then mum says it's her who has the contract and has to sort it out, although it went to sibling's house,

Not sure what is going to happen re the electrics, guess sibling will have to pay, if she doesn't want her partner to do it.

The question is - is there a reason to expect the full installation to be refunded as the installation wasn't possible?

Why is AO involved here if cooker was bought from Argos?

As this is a change of mind return in effect. Then the electricians have done some of the install work & have found the home electrics not up to the required std.

Woodstok2000

There's nothing I can see in the argos terms about checking electrical wiring or consumer units prior to an installation, so seems like a clear case for a refund. Escalate with argos and raise a formal complaint. If that fails, go to the credit card company for an S75 refund.

Okell

Upsidedownyouturnme said:

... Mum is desperately trying to contact Argos to get a refund for the connection fee as sibling has told her that AO said she is entitled to one.  Argos are only offering a small discount...

Of what relevance is AO to this if bought from Argos?

Woodstok2000

Okell said:

Upsidedownyouturnme said:

... Mum is desperately trying to contact Argos to get a refund for the connection fee as sibling has told her that AO said she is entitled to one.  Argos are only offering a small discount...

Of what relevance is AO to this if bought from Argos?

Argos probably use AO as one of their delivery/installation partners

Upsidedownyouturnme

As Woodstok2000 said, AO was the one who delivered it and were going to install it, they apparently told my sibling that a refund for installation was due, Argos are the one the contract is with (I was confused too).

Alderbank

Woodstok2000 said:

There's nothing I can see in the argos terms about checking electrical wiring or consumer units prior to an installation, so seems like a clear case for a refund. Escalate with argos and raise a formal complaint. If that fails, go to the credit card company for an S75 refund.

Argos say:

https://help.argos.co.uk/help/installation/what-do-i-need-to-do-in-advance-of-my-product-being-installed

What do I need to do in advance of my product being installed?

Before our colleagues arrive to install your appliance there are some things you'll need to check.

Ensure there is a suitable power point within 1m of where you want the product to be installed.

The OP's problem seems to be that the supplier's electrician decided that there is no suitable power point where they wanted the cooker to be installed because 'she has no trip switch on her consumer box'.

This is difficult because we don't know the detail of the reasons for his decision. It is not illegal to hard wire an oven to an old-style fuse box but it must be 'safe'. Also it is likely that the cooker connection is via a cooker point which also has a 3 pin socket and such a socket is now illegal under the current version of the wiring regulations.

OP, can you tell us any more about why the electrician decided the installation would be unsafe?

Upsidedownyouturnme

Alderbank said:

Woodstok2000 said:

There's nothing I can see in the argos terms about checking electrical wiring or consumer units prior to an installation, so seems like a clear case for a refund. Escalate with argos and raise a formal complaint. If that fails, go to the credit card company for an S75 refund.

Argos say:

https://help.argos.co.uk/help/installation/what-do-i-need-to-do-in-advance-of-my-product-being-installed

What do I need to do in advance of my product being installed?

Before our colleagues arrive to install your appliance there are some things you'll need to check.

Ensure there is a suitable power point within 1m of where you want the product to be installed.

The OP's problem seems to be that the supplier's electrician decided that there is no suitable power point where they wanted the cooker to be installed because 'she has no trip switch on her consumer box'.

This is difficult because we don't know the detail of the reasons for his decision. It is not illegal to hard wire an oven to an old-style fuse box but it must be 'safe'. Also it is likely that the cooker connection is via a cooker point which also has a 3 pin socket and such a socket is now illegal under the current version of the wiring regulations.

OP, can you tell us any more about why the electrician decided the installation would be unsafe?

Unfortunately the only information I have is that they said it couldn't be installed without a trip box.

There has been electric cookers there previously (up until today in fact), the previous one being wired by the partner.

It's impossible to get much out of sibling as they never answer direct questions, talking about their other problems and being hysterical about the refund.

I've managed to get more information from mum, but she is feeling harassed and is in her mid 80s, so finds it more confusing.

I did think it was possible for it to be installed, but I'm afraid all they've both told me is that it's impossible without a trip switch in the consumer box.

Sorry I'm not much help, it's impossible to advise them, when they don't understand either.

Thank you.

Ergates

Is the partner a qualified/certified electrician?

Woodstok2000

I would definitely escalate the complaint with argos, then claim back on s75 with the credit card if that doesn't work. If you had an oven wired in previously woth no issues I think youve covered your responsibilities in terms of the pre-install check, and it would have taken the installer 30 seconds to realise there's no trip and so he can't proceed. No way should you be liable for the fee here.

TadleyBaggie

Seems it is a requirement:

Yes, for safety and to comply with electrical codes, an oven must be connected to its own dedicated circuit, which is protected by a circuit breaker at the consumer unit (fuse box). This is required for almost all full-sized electric ovens due to their high power consumption. 

Probably in the past, this was almost certainly not a requirement but the requirements change. The fact that it was previously wired to the same circuit, doesn't mitigate this. Seems the AO installer was totally correct.