Will the new EV per-mile tax change your purchasing plans?

MattMattMattUK

I'm going to get an EV anyway

ButterCheese said:

MattMattMattUK said:

It is still a stupid idea though, they should have increased fuel duty. 

Why do you say that?  Surely the fairest way to tax everyone who uses the roads is to tax ICE users at the pump, and EV users by the mile.

Largely because the government are still trying to get people to transition to EVs, adding disincentives, even if relatively small, is not sensible. Fairness is subjective, especially as ICE vehicles do not pay anything close to the cost of their pollution. A pay per mile is also cumbersome and open to fraud, it makes far more sense to accept the loss of revenue that will occur decades in the from fuel duty declining by covering it from general taxation.

ButterCheese said:

Unless you think it's all to do with emissions, in which case EVs are as harmful but simply don't blow it out an exhaust.  The digging for rare earth metals, disposal of batteries and the fossil fuels used in production sort of cancel out any exhaust gases they don't produce

There should be an emission component, most EVs are charged at night from excess base load, or smart charged during the day from excess solar generation, they generally use very little if any fossil fuel energy. 

Digging for rare earth's is localised and can be mostly mitigated even if it has not been properly so far, disposal of batteries appears to not be an issue at all, it was hugely overblown by climate deniers and those with vested interests.

MattMattMattUK

I'm going to get an EV anyway

sheenas said:

MattMattMattUK said:

An EV is still considerably cheaper to run than an ICE vehicle even with this silly idea implemented. 

No significant impact on the price of EV or ICE vehicles on the second hand market. 

It is still a stupid idea though, they should have increased fuel duty. 

The hole point of the Tax is to replace fuel duty, what you plan when ICE are banned?

Cover the cost from general taxation, we should be simplifying the tax system, not making it more complicated. Added to which ICE vehicles are going to be around for several more decades, they will likely still be the majority of vehicles for at least a decade, probably longer.

paradigital

I have an EV and an ICE (petrol turbo) and the wife has a PHEV.  

The one that stings is the PHEV, it has at best a range of 24 electric miles, so being charged a 1.5p/mile surcharge AND VED, AND fuel duty is, in my opinion unfair.

I wanted to replace it with an EV, but currently don’t fancy taking a financial bath as I did with my EV, so the PHEVs likely replacement will not have any plug-in capability.

sheenas

MattMattMattUK said:

sheenas said:

MattMattMattUK said:

An EV is still considerably cheaper to run than an ICE vehicle even with this silly idea implemented. 

No significant impact on the price of EV or ICE vehicles on the second hand market. 

It is still a stupid idea though, they should have increased fuel duty. 

The hole point of the Tax is to replace fuel duty, what you plan when ICE are banned?

Cover the cost from general taxation, we should be simplifying the tax system, not making it more complicated. Added to which ICE vehicles are going to be around for several more decades, they will likely still be the majority of vehicles for at least a decade, probably longer.

Not sure what ICE cars have to do with this, they already pay tax. EV don’t have the same tax to discourage unnecessary use. 

I am  also not sure why you expect me to pay for EV car usage. I am already paying to upgrade the electricity network, so you can charge it. 

Grumpy_chap

born_again said:

something has to replace the annual £25 Billion fuel duty rakes in..

I am asking out of interest (because I genuinely do not know), if fuel duty currently generates £25 Billion, what is the most it has generated?  Did the amount raised via this process fall following COVID with the significant increase of WFH?  If so, how was that differential filled?

subjecttocontract

I was going to get an EV but won't now

I think the 3p per mile in isolation is not so bad but taken together with the total package changes the situation.
* The cars are more expensive to buy than ICE cars.
* They suffer higher depreciation.
* Public chargers can be very costly.
* Winter weather affects vehicle range.
If you want one, get one, good luck with it but it won't be for me.

Tree_pipe99

I'm going to get an EV anyway

I'm not sure why 3p per mile tax would put anyone off running an EV when running a petrol/diesel car costs more than double that in fuel duty tax and VAT.

The only thing I can think of is someone running an EV but can't charge at home. Public charging can cost as much as petrol or more, so that scenario won't make sense if public charging costs don't come down by 2028. 

Johnmcl7

I wasn't going to get an EV anyway

I've no plans to buy an electric car but the proposed mileage charge wouldn't impact my decision, I only do 2000-3000 miles on average a year so it would be a small cost.

DrEskimo

I'm going to get an EV anyway

subjecttocontract said:

I think the 3p per mile in isolation is not so bad but taken together with the total package changes the situation.
* The cars are more expensive to buy than ICE cars.
* They suffer higher depreciation.
* Public chargers can be very costly.
* Winter weather affects vehicle range.
If you want one, get one, good luck with it but it won't be for me.

To be fair, you can negate both the first points by buying used - thats what I do!

Also the second two points depend on your usage. In my Zoe that I owned for 5-years I did some public charging, but largely before the big price rise in electricity and due to the Zoe only having a 41kWh battery meant a real-world range of ~120 winter and ~180 summer. Now I have a Model S with a 100kWh battery, I get a solid ~220 winter and ~280 summer. In just over a year of ownership and 12,000 miles, I have not once used a public charger. 

The most interesting detail I am waiting for is whether this will apply to only new EVs or ALL EVs. Last budget was the first instance I can recall of VED changes applying retrospectively to cars registered from 2017, so suspect it will hit the same pool of EVs. Currently do around 12,000 miles, so on top of the £195 VED will be around £555/year. As others have said, not thrilled but not a big deal and I currently pay a flat £240 for all my EV charging (Octopus Drive Pack), which for a big inefficient Model S Performance that can do 0-60 in sub 3secs isn't bad when compared to the fuel costs of a similar ICE....so yes, still happy to be an EV driver and 6-years on still no reason to go back to ICE.

Bigwheels1111

I drive a £400,000 or £550,000 EV every day. ( A Bus ) 
It’s a nice smooth drive.
My opinion on EV’S has changed, from no way ever will I get one.
To if I have a driveway when I move I will seriously consider an EV.

All will come down to cost.
I like the MGS5 Trophy.
Can be had for 10k off list price brand new @ £23k.
5k for trading in my old car = £18k for and upgrade.
Off peak charging at 2p a mile + 3p for surcharge is still a third of what my diesel costs me.
I might save £400 a year fuel wise.

Or I may go mad and get a sub 4 second 0-60 EV.

I keep my cars for 10-15 years, my old car has lost 1k a year from new.
Was a Pre reg with 8 miles on the clock.


Has the surcharge changed my mind, No not really.