Group Nexus / CP Plus Ltd PCN ...already appealed

piggypower

Firstly, what an incredible site. I have dug deep into the FAQs and newbies section and wish I had found all this before responding to the PCN. I did appeal it. Rejected by the NexusGroup/CP PLus Ltd.

Moto Chieveley services. 
Arrived at 2:18am. 
EXHAUSTED after ridiculous delays on the M6 coming down from Scotland... I chose to stop for a nap rather than barrel roll to my death. 
Intending to stop for an hour or so, I didnt. 

The ANPR shows arrival at 2:18am, departing at 6:30am. I shut my eyes and had no idea I had slept so long. 

So from what I can see on the forum, I should NOT have accepted I was the driver, however, I have done this. 
My appeal was weak perhaps, based on all the info on here, but I basically said they had evidence of my arrival and departure, but no evidence of me actually parked and therefore, they cannot charge me for parking. (£100)

I was about to appeal with POPLA and did some more googling and found this forum. 

The reduced £60 can be paid within the next 14days (12days now)

I did search on this forum with many different search criteria to see if other cases could be found, I read a lot of interesting info, but none like mine....
therefore I am sorry to have started a new thread, but any advice would be most welcome. 

I have looked on Google maps, the signs are large and obvious as you drive in (not sure how well lit they are at night though) but honestly, I was so tired and just focused on where to go when arriving at a services I had never visited before feeling like my eyes were already closing. 

ANY advice welcome, I am VERY sorry if I have missed vital info in the FAQ etc that I should not have missed. 

Nellymoser

You may find this famous case interesting 

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/aug/26/parking-eye-takes-on-top-barrister-85-fine

Castle

piggypower said:

Firstly, what an incredible site. I have dug deep into the FAQs and newbies section and wish I had found all this before responding to the PCN. I did appeal it. Rejected by the NexusGroup/CP PLus Ltd.

Moto Chieveley services. 
Arrived at 2:18am. 
EXHAUSTED after ridiculous delays on the M6 coming down from Scotland... I chose to stop for a nap rather than barrel roll to my death. 
Intending to stop for an hour or so, I didnt. 

Do you live in Scotland?

Coupon-mad

If you do, you just ignore private PCNs.

The law will change next year so you will have keeper liability for the first time but you'll also have a proper appeals service (if the Government make the right call and set up a Single Appeals Service).

piggypower

Coupon-mad said:

If you do, you just ignore private PCNs.

The law will change next year so you will have keeper liability for the first time but you'll also have a proper appeals service (if the Government make the right call and set up a Single Appeals Service).

 If I do... what? 

piggypower

Castle said:

piggypower said:

Firstly, what an incredible site. I have dug deep into the FAQs and newbies section and wish I had found all this before responding to the PCN. I did appeal it. Rejected by the NexusGroup/CP PLus Ltd.

Moto Chieveley services. 
Arrived at 2:18am. 
EXHAUSTED after ridiculous delays on the M6 coming down from Scotland... I chose to stop for a nap rather than barrel roll to my death. 
Intending to stop for an hour or so, I didnt. 

Do you live in Scotland?

No I dont. 

piggypower

Nellymoser said:

You may find this famous case interesting 

theguardian....

It is interesting thankyou, never heard of it before. But interesting nonetheless. 

Still none the wiser though as to the next step I should take. 


Reading the initial PCN letter I got, the first paragraph states "you were the registered keeper when it was parked".. again... they have no evidence the vehicle was parked.. is this not a strong case?

Gr1pr

By "parked" they meant on site,  by capturing an entry and an exit,  so likely to be parked for a period of time within that leased property,  the MSA.  You are extremely unlikely to prove any other alternative,  so pointless trying 

On the balance of probabilities,  it was parked on site for a few hours., and was on site for 4 hours and 12 minutes, so likely to be parked for almost 4 hours 

As to having a strong case, depends who you are trying to convince,  popla or a judge  ?

You may win at popla based on the usual legal arguments of poor and inadequate signage  , none seen, plus no landowner authority,  putting GN to strict proof 

In court,  if it actually got to a hearing,  a judge might be swayed by the take a break arguments,  the tiredness kills, didn't see any signs, that's what MSAs are for,  resting up, etc , like Sir Nicholas Bowen

Chances are that any court claim would be discontinued before the hearing fee needed paying,  so a court hearing is unlikely 

piggypower

Gr1pr said:

By "parked" they meant on site,  by capturing an entry and an exit,  so likely to be parked for a period of time within that leased property,  the MSA.  You are extremely unlikely to prove any other alternative,  so pointless trying 

On the balance of probabilities,  it was parked on site for a few hours., and was on site for 4 hours and 12 minutes, so likely to be parked for almost 4 hours 

As to having a strong case, depends who you are trying to convince,  popla or a judge  ?

You may win at popla based on the usual legal arguments of poor and inadequate signage  , none seen, plus no landowner authority,  putting GN to strict proof 

In court,  if it actually got to a hearing,  a judge might be swayed by the take a break arguments,  the tiredness kills, didn't see any signs, that's what MSAs are for,  resting up, etc , like Sur Nicholas Bowen

Chances are that any court claim would be discontinued before the hearing fee needed paying,  so a court hearing is unlikely 

I guess what they want, is how I feel, just pay the £60 and then be done with all this faff. 

I'll be honest, looking at Google street view, the signs are large and placed at the entrance. However at night, I've no idea. I never remember seeing them or I would have done something about it I expect! I was tired and just trying to ensure I was headed towards the car park, not the HGV park. There certainly isnt any lights attached to the signs to illuminate them by the looks of google street view. 

I am assuming there must be landowner authority, I cant see a reason why there would not be. 

Castle

piggypower said:

I guess what they want, is how I feel, just pay the £60 and then be done with all this faff. 

I'll be honest, looking at Google street view, the signs are large and placed at the entrance. However at night, I've no idea. I never remember seeing them or I would have done something about it I expect! I was tired and just trying to ensure I was headed towards the car park, not the HGV park. There certainly isnt any lights attached to the signs to illuminate them by the looks of google street view. 

I am assuming there must be landowner authority, I cant see a reason why there would not be. 

They may be readable in daylight but what about at 2.18am.

Coupon-mad

piggypower said:

I am assuming there must be landowner authority, I cant see a reason why there would not be. 

There always is. That's not the point.