Carpenter won't give me an itemised receipt

TELLIT01

awkwardpanda said:

The Tesco example isn't a good comparison as whilst I see where you are coming from, I get an itemised receipt from Tesco for the goods purchased.

Actually it's a very good example.  When you purchase from Tesco you get a final price for the item.  Tesco does not provide a breakdown of the cost of the can, the contents, labelling and distribution, profit marging etc.  What the builder provided is no different - a final price for the item.  I really think you are making a mountain out of a molehill and won't get the information no matter how much you complain.

Tucosalamanca

Would you have been happy if they added an hour's labour to prepare your itemised invoice, or requested an additional surcharge at this point?

Admin time costs just as much as time spent hanging the doors

As others have stated, it's not five minute job. Customer can have whatever they want, this needed to be agreed and costed before works commence.

They offered a price you were happy with, you accepted.

Very glad that you're happy with the quality of work, very sorry for the trader who's precious time you are now taking up (free of charge).

awkwardpanda

Tucosalamanca said:

Would you have been happy if they added an hour's labour to prepare your itemised invoice, or requested an additional surcharge at this point?

Admin time costs just as much as time spent hanging the doors

As others have stated, it's not five minute job. Customer can have whatever they want, this needed to be agreed and costed before works commence.

They offered a price you were happy with, you accepted.

Very glad that you're happy with the quality of work, very sorry for the trader who's precious time you are now taking up (free of charge).

It shows how inefficient people here are if they can't even write an invoice with maybe 10 priced items on it in 5 minutes.

For invoices I submit to customers, I simply use a template and edit the details, it takes no time at all.

This company already knows the itemised numbers and calculations anyway, they just haven't written them down for me.

The businesses that are not computer illiterate or have arbitrary costs to hide will not get my business.  The ones that are transparent and professional and are able to produce a proper headed invoice and not something jotted in an email, will.  Example my car mechanic, plumber and electrician.

Taking up their time?  No, they wasted plenty of mine with slow replies and poor excuses (right from the start before even getting a quote or invoice).

Hoenir

awkwardpanda said:

Tucosalamanca said:

Would you have been happy if they added an hour's labour to prepare your itemised invoice, or requested an additional surcharge at this point?

Admin time costs just as much as time spent hanging the doors

As others have stated, it's not five minute job. Customer can have whatever they want, this needed to be agreed and costed before works commence.

They offered a price you were happy with, you accepted.

Very glad that you're happy with the quality of work, very sorry for the trader who's precious time you are now taking up (free of charge).

It shows how inefficient people here are if they can't even write an invoice with maybe 10 priced items on it in 5 minutes.

Inefficiency comes from spending time doing unproductive tasks. Do you account to your employer for precisely how you spend your working day? 

Martin_the_Unjust

There is an old saying

’good trades don’t work for bad customers’

You may want to think about why you had so much trouble getting a chippy to hang a few doors, a job a good trades would have fitted in on any wet day.

Hoenir

Martin_the_Unjust said:

 a job a good trades would have fitted in on any wet day.

One reason labour has been in short supply recently.......

awkwardpanda

Martin_the_Unjust said:

There is an old saying

’good trades don’t work for bad customers’

You may want to think about why you had so much trouble getting a chippy to hang a few doors, a job a good trades would have fitted in on any wet day.

You mean the good tradesman who I tried to get a quote from for another job last September and I got no reply (despite chasing).

The same company who when enquiring about this recent job, took 2 months (I may have accidentally said 3 months in another message) to even give me a quote.  Yeah exactly the sort of company I'm going to race to use again.

BlueonBlue

Martin_the_Unjust said:

There is an old saying

’good trades don’t work for bad customers’

You may want to think about why you had so much trouble getting a chippy to hang a few doors, a job a good trades would have fitted in on any wet day.

This is very likely exactly what has happened .

The chippy who took it on would have picked up on the differcult customer aspect when quoting and priced in the obvious headache that was coming.
If the op doesnt pay up..... the chippy will very likely know what to do next as well because the op will be far from the first.

Doozergirl

awkwardpanda said:

Tucosalamanca said:

Would you have been happy if they added an hour's labour to prepare your itemised invoice, or requested an additional surcharge at this point?

Admin time costs just as much as time spent hanging the doors

As others have stated, it's not five minute job. Customer can have whatever they want, this needed to be agreed and costed before works commence.

They offered a price you were happy with, you accepted.

Very glad that you're happy with the quality of work, very sorry for the trader who's precious time you are now taking up (free of charge).

It shows how inefficient people here are if they can't even write an invoice with maybe 10 priced items on it in 5 minutes.

For invoices I submit to customers, I simply use a template and edit the details, it takes no time at all.

This company already knows the itemised numbers and calculations anyway, they just haven't written them down for me.

The businesses that are not computer illiterate or have arbitrary costs to hide will not get my business.  The ones that are transparent and professional and are able to produce a proper headed invoice and not something jotted in an email, will.  Example my car mechanic, plumber and electrician.

Taking up their time?  No, they wasted plenty of mine with slow replies and poor excuses (right from the start before even getting a quote or invoice).

Well, it will take you even longer to find a carpenter next time.  He won't see it as his loss if you don't call him again.  

The Apprenticeship Standard for Carpentry doesn't include being able to work Excel, which is why people like him will seek to work for people that don't ask too many questions and take him on his word. 

I've spent a lifetime working with people like him - great at their jobs, but many of them are almost illiterate.  That doesn't make them anything less than brilliant at what they do.  

His wife almost certainly has her own job, plus a family to run as well.  

Enjoy your doors.  

mlz1413

awkwardpanda said:

I had 6 doors fitted by a husband and wife carpentry company local to me.  Communication has been dire throughout due to continued excuses about someone being ill or the kids keeping them busy.  I was desperate to get the job done though after struggling to find someone to even give me a quote!

Eventually they did the job and the husband who did the work did a fantastic job so no problem there.  However it is his wife that does all the accounts and the one who gives me a life story about what has prevented her from getting back to me (hospital visits, kids etc).  I just want answers to questions not a life story, anyway I digress.

Before the work was done I was given a quote and I asked for it to be itemised so I could see exactly what was being spent on what.  I never got that and then the work was complete.  Afterwards I still wanted the itemised list of parts used priced up for me as I was suspicious they had significantly overcharged on the fixings for the doors.

All I've got were more excuses about illness in the family and the kids keeping them busy (can they even run a business?).  They have recently said that they don't usually give itemised receipts, and are gaslighting me saying that none of their trade friends do either.  I've had both a plumber and electrician in recently and both have given me a breakdown of costs on a proper headed invoice.

The carpenter wife has simply given me a few numbers typed in an email, no headed invoice/receipt and no list of individual items.

Now she is saying that the accounts are with the accountant, insinuating that she doesn't have the numbers to give me I guess.  The wholesaler won't give me the prices either or a copy of the receipt given to the carpenter due to GDPR.  So I'm a bit stuck and all I want is a itemised receipt!

For a sense of time; I first contacted them 5 months ago and the job was only done one month ago.

What would you do if in my position and worried you may have been overcharged for items?

Im guessing your name AwkwardPanda is a hint!

From the sound of your post you want the itemised prices so you can beat them over the head with overcharging you and get some money back. 
But you agreed to a price, paid the pice and are happy with the work... so why do you now need to scrutinise the cost?

Surely you could have done this before agreeing to the work?  As in priced up hinges, handles and doors and then decided on what you were prepared to pay for labour, then that would have been your maximum price.

If you didn't know what to look for before the job was done then remember you have to pay for that experience. 

You have spent time ringing trade companies to get the details of what a trade person paid and are frustrated not to be supplied with what you want...  

You have also spent time ringing the wife for details she isn't in a position to give,  but even though she repeatedly details her other life commitments, you just think this is excuses to not get information on how they run their business and what profit they make.

Take a step back, not everyone is organised,  not everyone has the desire to be organised, but luckily we are all different.