Carpenter won't give me an itemised receipt

awkwardpanda

I had 6 doors fitted by a husband and wife carpentry company local to me.  Communication has been dire throughout due to continued excuses about someone being ill or the kids keeping them busy.  I was desperate to get the job done though after struggling to find someone to even give me a quote!

Eventually they did the job and the husband who did the work did a fantastic job so no problem there.  However it is his wife that does all the accounts and the one who gives me a life story about what has prevented her from getting back to me (hospital visits, kids etc).  I just want answers to questions not a life story, anyway I digress.

Before the work was done I was given a quote and I asked for it to be itemised so I could see exactly what was being spent on what.  I never got that and then the work was complete.  Afterwards I still wanted the itemised list of parts used priced up for me as I was suspicious they had significantly overcharged on the fixings for the doors.

All I've got were more excuses about illness in the family and the kids keeping them busy (can they even run a business?).  They have recently said that they don't usually give itemised receipts, and are gaslighting me saying that none of their trade friends do either.  I've had both a plumber and electrician in recently and both have given me a breakdown of costs on a proper headed invoice.

The carpenter wife has simply given me a few numbers typed in an email, no headed invoice/receipt and no list of individual items.

Now she is saying that the accounts are with the accountant, insinuating that she doesn't have the numbers to give me I guess.  The wholesaler won't give me the prices either or a copy of the receipt given to the carpenter due to GDPR.  So I'm a bit stuck and all I want is a itemised receipt!

For a sense of time; I first contacted them 5 months ago and the job was only done one month ago.

What would you do if in my position and worried you may have been overcharged for items?

DE_612183

you may not get actual prices of what the carpenter paid - after all they always include a margin and then perhaps some additional money for collection / transport etc.

If you were happy with the quote and have paid it - what more do you want.

If you do get an itemised invoice this would no doubt equal the amount you paid where do you go from there?

If you do find out that a hinge they charged you £10 is actually £8 in B&Q what will you do?

MeteredOut

If you required an itemised breakdown, then you should not have allowed the work to start before receiving it. You had the total price and (presumably) agreed to that price for the work.

I suspect the carpenter/wife is worried you'll see how much they've charged as a day rate resulting in a complaint, perhaps because you were so persistent about getting it itemised in previous discussions.

I'd put this down as a learning experience for the next time you're distrusting of people you book - don't allow the work to start without the itemised invoice, but accept that some people will avoid customers that insist.

The wholesaler is correct in not giving you a copy of the receipt for something someone else bought.

Cressida100

Personally if they did a fantastic job I wouldn't worry too much about itemised receipts. 

la531983

There is a Facebook group called Nightmare Customers and Non Payers. See many examples on there of customers demanding details of every single thing bought, even down to nails.

Just leaving that there.

TELLIT01

They provided a quote, that quote was accepted and the job completed.  Getting an itemised bill now will make no difference.  The labour charge can be anything the contractor wants it to be and there is no comeback.  The time to ask questions was before having the work done.

awkwardpanda

I did query the cost of materials a while back and they gave a vague answer about costs adding up and costs associated with storing the doors prior to fitting them.  However the doors were purchased on the first day they came as they bought everything on the way to my house.

I just feel they are not being transparent with me.  If they can give me prices that make sense then fine, but that's just it, the price of the materials (labour was priced separately and looked ok) doesn't seem to add up.

Now I feel like I am being made out to be a bogeyman for just wanting a proper receipt like you would get anywhere else.

Exodi

awkwardpanda said:

Afterwards I still wanted the itemised list of parts used priced up for me as I was suspicious they had significantly overcharged on the fixings for the doors.

How could you be suspicious you have been overcharged for the fixings if you don't know what they charged you for them?

Out of curiosity what would you prefer:

They build their margin into the price of the items (and you'll complain that they overcharged for the fixings) or they build their margin into the day rate (and you'll complain "wow £500 a day!")

Clearly they recognise what is unfolding, hence their continued excuses and palming off of you.

If you thought you were being overcharged, you shouldn't have instructed them to do the work. It's really unfair on the trader to start doing this now after the work has been completed.

awkwardpanda

TELLIT01 said:

They provided a quote, that quote was accepted and the job completed.  Getting an itemised bill now will make no difference.  The labour charge can be anything the contractor wants it to be and there is no comeback.  The time to ask questions was before having the work done.

I asked for a better breakdown of costs before payment, but it had already taken me 3 months to even get to the point of getting them to give me a quote in the first place and a date of the work being done.  I would have preferred to know before committing but the wait time of getting someone in was already getting out of control so I didn't want it to be further delayed and thought they would respond quicker.

I run my own business and I always give a transparent breakdown of costs on my invoices/receipts.

DullGreyGuy

awkwardpanda said:

I did query the cost of materials a while back and they gave a vague answer about costs adding up and costs associated with storing the doors prior to fitting them.  However the doors were purchased on the first day they came as they bought everything on the way to my house.

I just feel they are not being transparent with me.  If they can give me prices that make sense then fine, but that's just it, the price of the materials (labour was priced separately and looked ok) doesn't seem to add up.

Now I feel like I am being made out to be a bogeyman for just wanting a proper receipt like you would get anywhere else.

You were happy enough with the price
You seem very happy with the work

You have no statutory right to know the breakdown of the price of the job, if it was so important to you then you should have held off having the work done until they gave a price breakdown because as soon as it was done you lost your bargaining chip.

They could tell you they charged you £1 per door and £600 fitting per door, its a somewhat arbitrary split and some will genuinely charge more on labour and pass parts on at cost whereas others will charge less on labour but markup parts more. At the end of the day if its £601 per door what does the split matter? 

Have you ever gone into Tesco's and ask them to provide a breakdown of why they charge 74p for a loaf of their own bread and how much goes on labour, utilities, raw ingredients, packaging etc? 

awkwardpanda

Exodi said:

awkwardpanda said:

Afterwards I still wanted the itemised list of parts used priced up for me as I was suspicious they had significantly overcharged on the fixings for the doors.

How could you be suspicious you have been overcharged for the fixings if you don't know what they charged you for them?

Out of curiosity what would you prefer:

They build their margin into the price of the items (and you'll complain that they overcharged for the fixings) or they build their margin into the day rate (and you'll complain "wow £500 a day!")

Clearly they recognise what is unfolding, hence their continued excuses and palming off of you.

If you thought you were being overcharged, you shouldn't have instructed them to do the work. It's really unfair on the trader to start doing this now after the work has been completed.

They gave me a total figure for the doors, fixings and oil, but nothing more detailed than that.  I already had an idea of the cost of the doors.

I guess I would expect them to price parts as what it cost them plus VAT, and their profit is in the labour as that is how the electrician and plumber I used recently did it.

It's become less about the cost now and more about their resistance to what I think is a perfectly normal request that would literally take 5 mins to do.  They should and could have done it when I first asked before I committed.