Insane Energy Bill

SubZombies

Exodi said:

EssexHebridean said:

We'll see if they come back - my bet bet though is along with others - heaters left on in bedrooms, plus the combination of three people having showers and the immersion being on constantly so it just chitters away topping up all the time, then working harder for a spell after another shower has been had (possibly lengthy ones if this a household of all young adults on their first time away from home and responsible for bills). Add in all cooking at different times - and maybe one saying "Oh just leave the oven on- I'll be doing mine in a bit" then getting caught up gaming and not using the oven for another couple of hours... 

EssexHebridean illustrates.

I remember when my older sister used to constantly complain to me about her electricity bill being over triple mine.

The reason for it was that my younger sister lived with my older sister, and she would spend the majority of the day playing on a gaming PC (and used to sleep with games running, because she couldn't miss something). Unfortunately because of the heat generated by the gaming PC being on all day in a closed room, she had a mini fridge in her room to keep cold drinks as well as an air conditioning unit she left on pretty much 24/7 also.

If I'm understanding the OP correctly, he was paying £150 a month for 5 months (so £750) and has been asked to pay an additional £2700 (so an additional £540 per month), meaning an actual spend of £690 per month.

That's about 10x what I use (and I have an EV!), but it's not totally impossible if you combine 1 or 2 people behaving like my younger sister, with an immersion heater and ge@EssexHebridean.

Unfortunately it doesn't appear the OP is planning to action the points made by forum members so I suspect this thread will forever remain speculation.

Sorry been a very hectic couple of days. The issue has been located!!  The immersion heater a faulty heating element which was drawing current but not fully heating the water up so never triggered the thermostat. It has run 24/7 since August!  Our landlord has sent someone out to fix it and the meter sanity test is now showing no anomalies . 

We are trying to get our landlord to pay at least part of this because it was broken when we moved in so we never questioned it as we had hot water ( albeit not masses but now we have plenty) so could still shower etc.  

Thanks to everyone for all the various suggestions on how to get this sorted. Onto the next part of the saga to see if the landlord will pay!

MeteredOut

SubZombies said:

Exodi said:

EssexHebridean said:

We'll see if they come back - my bet bet though is along with others - heaters left on in bedrooms, plus the combination of three people having showers and the immersion being on constantly so it just chitters away topping up all the time, then working harder for a spell after another shower has been had (possibly lengthy ones if this a household of all young adults on their first time away from home and responsible for bills). Add in all cooking at different times - and maybe one saying "Oh just leave the oven on- I'll be doing mine in a bit" then getting caught up gaming and not using the oven for another couple of hours... 

EssexHebridean illustrates.

I remember when my older sister used to constantly complain to me about her electricity bill being over triple mine.

The reason for it was that my younger sister lived with my older sister, and she would spend the majority of the day playing on a gaming PC (and used to sleep with games running, because she couldn't miss something). Unfortunately because of the heat generated by the gaming PC being on all day in a closed room, she had a mini fridge in her room to keep cold drinks as well as an air conditioning unit she left on pretty much 24/7 also.

If I'm understanding the OP correctly, he was paying £150 a month for 5 months (so £750) and has been asked to pay an additional £2700 (so an additional £540 per month), meaning an actual spend of £690 per month.

That's about 10x what I use (and I have an EV!), but it's not totally impossible if you combine 1 or 2 people behaving like my younger sister, with an immersion heater and ge@EssexHebridean.

Unfortunately it doesn't appear the OP is planning to action the points made by forum members so I suspect this thread will forever remain speculation.

Sorry been a very hectic couple of days. The issue has been located!!  The immersion heater a faulty heating element which was drawing current but not fully heating the water up so never triggered the thermostat. It has run 24/7 since August!  Our landlord has sent someone out to fix it and the meter sanity test is now showing no anomalies . 

We are trying to get our landlord to pay at least part of this because it was broken when we moved in so we never questioned it as we had hot water ( albeit not masses but now we have plenty) so could still shower etc.  

Thanks to everyone for all the various suggestions on how to get this sorted. Onto the next part of the saga to see if the landlord will pay!

Glad you got to the bottom of it, and I hope the landlord helps you out, but I suspect that would be a gesture of goodwill only.

lohr500

Call me an old cynic, but I hope your landlord is being totally honest with you.

The fact is that if the immersion heater wasn't heating the water, but was still drawing the 2-3kW per hour that someone estimated earlier, then all that energy must have been going somewhere.
That much energy usage is equivalent to running a fan heater on the highest setting permanently.

If the element was shorting out, it should have blown a fuse or tripped a breaker in the fuse box.
So how could it be dissipating 2 to 3kWh for several months without heating the water adequately?

Could it be that the energy was being used elsewhere in the building and the Landlord or some other tennant has been rumbled?!    

tim_p

lohr500 said:

Call me an old cynic, but I hope your landlord is being totally honest with you.

The fact is that if the immersion heater wasn't heating the water, but was still drawing the 2-3kW per hour that someone estimated earlier, then all that energy must have been going somewhere.
That much energy usage is equivalent to running a fan heater on the highest setting permanently.

If the element was shorting out, it should have blown a fuse or tripped a breaker in the fuse box.
So how could it be dissipating 2 to 3kWh for several months without heating the water adequately?

Could it be that the energy was being used elsewhere in the building and the Landlord or some other tennant has been rumbled?!    

Far, far more likely scenario. The fault described simply can’t happen with no visible effect. That 2-3kW load has to end up as heat. 

Gerry1

lohr500 said:
Could it be that the energy was being used elsewhere in the building and the Landlord has been rumbled?!    

There's certainly something still not quite right here.  Is the property a Victorian villa or similar that's been divided up into flats? It's not impossible that your supply was also supplying another flat or heating and/or lighting in the common areas.  Mistakes or fiddles can happen.

Similarly, does the landlord or one of their friends/relatives live in one of the flats?  It may not be just the electricity cables you need to check, it could be a hot water pipe that goes off somewhere it shouldn't, perhaps giving someone lots of long hot showers.  If your water is metered, check whether consumption reduces from now on.

MeteredOut

Perhaps ask the landlord for a copy the electricians report, although they will not have to provide it. You could say you need it for negotiations with the energy suppliers over the excessive bill. Their reaction to this might indicate whether they're having you on.

Reed_Richards

I have a theory that if the water tank overheats but doesn't trigger a cut-out and it's a pressurised cylinder then you could get a continuous flow of hot water down the tundish.  This would be most likely if the pressure vessel has failed so the water in the tank expands as it is heated,  If this could happen it would have much the same effect as leaving a hot tap running and would allow the immersion heater to remain on constantly.  This has never happened to me and despite fairly frequent reports here of a faulty immersion heater being on all the time nobody has ever mentioned water being discharged via the tundish.  So it's just a theory without proof   

lohr500

@Reed_Richards

It's a possibility I guess, but in the last reply OP posted that before the IH was "fixed" they didn't have masses of hot water, but now they do.

  "as we had hot water ( albeit not masses but now we have plenty)"

Presumably if the IH was running 24/7 and allowing hot water to flow into a tundish, then they should have had plenty of hot water previously?

Gerry1

lohr500 said:

@Reed_Richards

It's a possibility I guess, but in the last reply OP posted that before the IH was "fixed" they didn't have masses of hot water, but now they do.
  "as we had hot water ( albeit not masses but now we have plenty)"
Presumably if the IH was running 24/7 and allowing hot water to flow into a tundish, then they should have had plenty of hot water previously?

If the upper immersion heater was permanently on but the hot water was always draining away via the tundish, the hot water in the lower half (heated up overnight by the lower heater) would soon have been replaced by incoming cold water.

At most times of day there wouldn't have been a full tank of hot water so it would have run cool after a shower or two.

Scot_39

lohr500 said:

Call me an old cynic, but I hope your landlord is being totally honest with you.

The fact is that if the immersion heater wasn't heating the water, but was still drawing the 2-3kW per hour that someone estimated earlier, then all that energy must have been going somewhere.
That much energy usage is equivalent to running a fan heater on the highest setting permanently.

If the element was shorting out, it should have blown a fuse or tripped a breaker in the fuse box.
So how could it be dissipating 2 to 3kWh for several months without heating the water adequately?

Could it be that the energy was being used elsewhere in the building and the Landlord or some other tennant has been rumbled?!    

Water tanks in flats are normally unvented and may have both a temp and pressure release, as well as an expansion tank for pressure relief, which again can vent.

It would seem possible that a faulty thermostat on immersion heater might have been overheating - or a faulty relief valve could have been leaking a fair amount of water even at normal temperature.  And so tank never fully warm.

A metered water supply might confirm if using a lot less hot water now if was a relief valve.

Just under 3kW being enough to raise around 50l from 10-60C iirc my tank figures.  And over 24 hours - that's a lot of water.