Advice on side access

ThisIsWeird

I still don't fully understand, Rommie. What parts of your back boundary line are currently fenced, for example? What about at the front - is there any physical boundary between your two driveways there?
As for points raised by others, I am of the mind that ignorant and/or entitled folk need putting back in their box. If you allow this to continue as it is, then you definitely will have future issues, because from now on your neighbour will be using that pathway without your permission - and that's a major problem.
'This neighb may have acquired a row already through usage' - an easement? Well, they'd better have evidence for that should they wish to pursue it - they cannot just 'claim' it. They'd need to prove continuous and extended usage, without the OP's permission. The TA6 suggests no such thing, and Rommie has simply 'allowed' him access, with Rommie being in no doubt at all it was with his permission.
'The neighb land act 1992'? Well, yes, we all have that 'right', but it doesn't mean you can walk onto someone else's land when you feel like it. You need to ask, or seek a court order. Rommie will make it clear that all he needs to do is 'ask', if he needs reasonable access for repair or maintenance. (Or, Rommie can be bludy awkward, and force them to get a court order each time, if the neighbour continues to be difficult). That is a completely separate issue to the neighb seemingly thinking he has the right to access Rommie's pathway at will.
Rommie holds the cards - in the form of his deeds. 
If this neighb wants access to his back garden, that's easy - he bludy well goes to his neighb to his right, goes down their pathway, and crosses their garden. If not, why the hell not? Oh yes - it ain't his land, and he has no right. Deja vu all over again. Ditto with Rommie's path.
I don't think your comments help, GDB. This neighb is either misguided, or is taking the pee. He needs to be told the facts of life. He needs to understand he has no 'right', so had better start being grateful and respectful. This is not a situation of Rommie's doing; it's his neighbour who is wrong here.
Rommie, the situation isn't helped by you not having LP, and you being reticent to act (although understandable). But I don't believe that you need to take legal action against the guy, as you have the facts on your side, so it's up to your neighbour to try and prove otherwise.
So you need to either let the guy continue to walk over your land when they feel like it, or else you tell him the facts of life.
There is a 'compromise' position, where you continue to allow him to use that side access, but only once he acknowledges that he does not have the right to, and it's only with your permission - and on your terms. If he doesn't acknowledge this, you tell him that the alternative is for you to block any further access. That's then his choice.
Also any other term you impose - no, you relative does not ride his bike past our cars, he walks it with care and a 'thank you'. No? Ok, gate locked, and police will be called if he trespasses.
"No, you haven't got any entitlement at all. The previous owner made this clear in the selling pack, and I have allowed you to have access down my land just for as long as I like, and as long as you don't take the Mick. I can demonstrate that in an instant by putting up a gate here. You touch it, and I'll call the police. Why don't you go down your other neighbour's alleyway and cross their land - see how far you get!" "So, are you going to carry on being silly about this, or are you going to start showing some appreciation for me allowing you to use my path?!"
If your neighbour wants to start legal action, that's up to him. But the deeds are clear, and the previous owner, and now you, both gave him permission to use it. It's only because of the nephew's actions, and the neighb's subsequent bolshiness, that you feel you need to rescind permission. End of. 
He'll need to prove otherwise.
He doesn't agree? Then get a fencer to put up a sturdy gate, lock it, and call the police the moment he touches it. Fit extra cameras if needed.
Just be calm and reasonable and friendly, but firm. Show surprise at anything unreasonable he says or claims. "Yes, of course you can have access to carry out repairs to that house side from my pathway, but you do know you should ask first, don't you? But, if you are going to be difficult about this, then I can refuse, and you'd have to go to court to get an order each time - would you want that?!"
"Show me where in your deeds it says you have the right to use that path? It doesn't say this, does it? So you don't have that right - any more than going down your other neighbour's alleyway and across their garden!"
"You've always done this, you say?! Only with my permission! And that of the previous owner. And only when you were respectful about it. That hasn't been the case recently, so I'm removing my permission. Do you now want to talk about this sensibly?"
"You'll carry on doing this, you say?! Well, that is trespass, as I have refused permission. How will you get past my gate? Do anything to it and that will be 'trespass with criminal property damage' - you really want to go there?!"
At any stage you can walk away, with a "I'm happy to discuss this later, once you've stopped being so silly/aggressive/talking over me/whatevs", and give them time to mull it over.
The ball is in your court.
Once you put a fence and gate up, he's very much on the back foot. Fait accomplis are powerful things.

ThisIsWeird

Rommie2021 said:

The other option is to try and ignore it until such time as the property is changing hands and move our gate and block the neighbouring one at that point?

 

I’m still really frustrated that the sellers were not entirely truthful about this on the property information form!

I think I can say a couple of things about this approach with nigh-on certain certainty.
The first is, if you don't address this, but let it ramble on with your neighb taking advantage, then you will feel under constant stress, and this will have a serious impact on the enjoyment of your home.
And the other point is, if you block that gate only when you are about to sell, you will cause a shed load of issues at that point, and it will almost certainly scupper your sale, and possibly worse.

Also, you don't know that your vendor fibbed in the TA6. It might well have been a situation that they were perfectly happy with, and consciously allowed. In fact, that is your understanding and 'take' on this; they always knew it was their path, fully within their curtilage, with no easements in the deeds, and no other legal concession, and therefore gave actual or implied permission to the neighbour to use it when they needed to, without always having to ask first.
You have done exactly the same. You always knew it was entirely, and solely, yours. You therefore 'allowed' the neighb to use it, but also had in your mind an intention to improve security at some point, so you knew you'd soon need to tell him, "Sorry, it can't just be left open/accessible at all times. I'm going to have to fit a secure gate, but if you need access at any point, please just ask".
The nephew's actions just brought this to a head, and are simply unacceptable on your property. You were frankly astonished that the neighb seemed to 'argue' about this access, so you have clarified the matter to him with reference to your respective deeds, and now need to enforce this with a secure gate. How 'secure' will come down to your neighbour's contrition; if they keep on arguing, then it's locked. If they say, "of course, I understand, and soz", then you may wish to consider giving them a key - on entirely your terms.
Note that your neighbour also mentioned that they'd need access for repairs and maintenance (you have this recorded), so that indicates that they do know they don't have unhindered access.

ThisIsWeird

Still reading, Rommie?!
Does this neighbour's offspring visit? Do you know them at all? Do they seem more reasonable? (I'm not holding out much hope for the parents of the bike-rider...).
But, a possible way forward is to ask one in for a cuppa if they appear more reasonable, and to explain the issue to them, and they can then pass the message on to their dad.
As before, keep it concise and simple. Make it absolutely clear that you don't want to make their dad's life difficult, but there needs to be recognition of the true situation here.
Also make it clear from the off that you are open to compromise on access, but only if they acknowledge that it is a offer you are making, and it's not an entitlement. You do not want to 'cut off' your dad's access, but there may need to be some terms applied - like who can access it, how to behave when they do, and that the gate may need to be relocked each time.
Have the facts ready, deeds and stuff, and stick to them:
Both sets of deeds are unambiguous on this, no question at all. (If that is the case.)
Both you and the previous owner understood the basis of how access was given, and gave permission for this to occur. That was always the understanding from your side. It was never the case that your side considered that the neighbour had a 'right'.
Concerns then raised by the careless actions of the nephew (handle that one carefully!) - you were astonished that someone would behave like that when coming on to your property, risking damage to your car, especially when you've been doing them a very considerable favour.
Then issue compounded by neighbour trying to suggest they have a right to use it, and are not simply benefitting from your, and the previous owner's, kind generosity and thoughtfulness.
And then present the two possible outcomes - they acknowledge this, continue to have access to the path with them demonstrating more consideration (and ideally) gratitude, or else access is refused. 
As always, if they talk over you, or 'go off on one', you stop talking, look at them impassively, wait for them to stop, and go back to the point you were making. Ie, ignore any daft points by them - dismiss daft issues by not entertaining them. Any fair points, then of course engage!
"Have a word with your dad, please. But the situation cannot continue as it is."
Oh, and covertly record all of this.
If the offspring is as unaccepting and unreasonable as their dad, then don't argue, but bring it to a halt with something like, "Ok. That's a shame. I was hoping to sort this amicably, and find an acceptable way forward - I was fully prepared to make significant compromises that would suit us both. But it looks as tho' that is no longer possible. Thanks for your time", shake hands, and show them the door. Give them a week to come back, and if nothing, get a fencer in. Fit gate at front of house, and seriously consider adding a low decorative barrier - posts and rope would do - to separate your driveways. 
Still smile, still wave, still say you are open to talking about it.

Keep this in mind during any conversations: YOU are doing THEM a favour. YOU are gaining NOTHING from this, other than a nice feeling of neighbourliness! Remind THEM of this too!

To answer your other Q, if the situation escalates with them threatening legal action - this is very unlikely - then, yes, there's a good chance that the previous owner can be shown to have withheld info - unless they agree that the situation is exactly as you describe; "Yes, of course - I gave MrX permission to use the path as we were friends and neighbours! But, no way was it ever suggested he has the right to! He's trying that on?! Maaaan, what's he like, eh!"

silvercar

I’d be downloading the title plan and deeds of your neighbour. Yours clearly shows you own all the alley way between the houses, but that kink worries me. I’d want to check that the neighbour’s deeds match and don’t show a shared alley way. 

Flugelhorn

silvercar said:

I’d be downloading the title plan and deeds of your neighbour. Yours clearly shows you own all the alley way between the houses, but that kink worries me. I’d want to check that the neighbour’s deeds match and don’t show a shared alley way. 

agree - that kink is odd - interesting to see the neighbour's plan - could be a case that that there are equally broad red lines on the ally there

ThisIsWeird

Rommie2021 said:

I’ve downloaded his deeds - he’s been there since 2001. His red boundary comes up to bt does not cross my red boundary.

Could you post his deeds map too, please? And look under the 'covenants' in the written section; put on here everything that's shown under these sections, positive and negative/restrictive/affirmative/whatevs.

Rommie2021

Bike rider is neighbour’s son. He’s an adult I would guess about the same age as me. 

The kink does exist in real life - our gate is at the kink and then his fence is slightly in. There is no fence at the front - the wall of neighbour’s house is most of the boundary, and then there is grass that is ours which borders his front driveway. 

I will need to download the doc again to post his, and I may not get chance to do that until later in the week. The covenants are just about not putting a fence at the front and not allowing caravans or encampments on the land. 

swingaloo

ThisIsWeird said:

I still don't fully understand, Rommie. What parts of your back boundary line are currently fenced, for example? What about at the front - is there any physical boundary between your two driveways there?
As for points raised by others, I am of the mind that ignorant and/or entitled folk need putting back in their box. If you allow this to continue as it is, then you definitely will have future issues, because from now on your neighbour will be using that pathway without your permission - and that's a major problem.
'This neighb may have acquired a row already through usage' - an easement? Well, they'd better have evidence for that should they wish to pursue it - they cannot just 'claim' it. They'd need to prove continuous and extended usage, without the OP's permission. The TA6 suggests no such thing, and Rommie has simply 'allowed' him access, with Rommie being in no doubt at all it was with his permission.
'The neighb land act 1992'? Well, yes, we all have that 'right', but it doesn't mean you can walk onto someone else's land when you feel like it. You need to ask, or seek a court order. Rommie will make it clear that all he needs to do is 'ask', if he needs reasonable access for repair or maintenance. (Or, Rommie can be bludy awkward, and force them to get a court order each time, if the neighbour continues to be difficult). That is a completely separate issue to the neighb seemingly thinking he has the right to access Rommie's pathway at will.
Rommie holds the cards - in the form of his deeds. 
If this neighb wants access to his back garden, that's easy - he bludy well goes to his neighb to his right, goes down their pathway, and crosses their garden. If not, why the hell not? Oh yes - it ain't his land, and he has no right. Deja vu all over again. Ditto with Rommie's path.
I don't think your comments help, GDB. This neighb is either misguided, or is taking the pee. He needs to be told the facts of life. He needs to understand he has no 'right', so had better start being grateful and respectful. This is not a situation of Rommie's doing; it's his neighbour who is wrong here.
Rommie, the situation isn't helped by you not having LP, and you being reticent to act (although understandable). But I don't believe that you need to take legal action against the guy, as you have the facts on your side, so it's up to your neighbour to try and prove otherwise.
So you need to either let the guy continue to walk over your land when they feel like it, or else you tell him the facts of life.
There is a 'compromise' position, where you continue to allow him to use that side access, but only once he acknowledges that he does not have the right to, and it's only with your permission - and on your terms. If he doesn't acknowledge this, you tell him that the alternative is for you to block any further access. That's then his choice.
Also any other term you impose - no, you relative does not ride his bike past our cars, he walks it with care and a 'thank you'. No? Ok, gate locked, and police will be called if he trespasses.
"No, you haven't got any entitlement at all. The previous owner made this clear in the selling pack, and I have allowed you to have access down my land just for as long as I like, and as long as you don't take the Mick. I can demonstrate that in an instant by putting up a gate here. You touch it, and I'll call the police. Why don't you go down your other neighbour's alleyway and cross their land - see how far you get!" "So, are you going to carry on being silly about this, or are you going to start showing some appreciation for me allowing you to use my path?!"
If your neighbour wants to start legal action, that's up to him. But the deeds are clear, and the previous owner, and now you, both gave him permission to use it. It's only because of the nephew's actions, and the neighb's subsequent bolshiness, that you feel you need to rescind permission. End of. 
He'll need to prove otherwise.
He doesn't agree? Then get a fencer to put up a sturdy gate, lock it, and call the police the moment he touches it. Fit extra cameras if needed.
Just be calm and reasonable and friendly, but firm. Show surprise at anything unreasonable he says or claims. "Yes, of course you can have access to carry out repairs to that house side from my pathway, but you do know you should ask first, don't you? But, if you are going to be difficult about this, then I can refuse, and you'd have to go to court to get an order each time - would you want that?!"
"Show me where in your deeds it says you have the right to use that path? It doesn't say this, does it? So you don't have that right - any more than going down your other neighbour's alleyway and across their garden!"
"You've always done this, you say?! Only with my permission! And that of the previous owner. And only when you were respectful about it. That hasn't been the case recently, so I'm removing my permission. Do you now want to talk about this sensibly?"
"You'll carry on doing this, you say?! Well, that is trespass, as I have refused permission. How will you get past my gate? Do anything to it and that will be 'trespass with criminal property damage' - you really want to go there?!"
At any stage you can walk away, with a "I'm happy to discuss this later, once you've stopped being so silly/aggressive/talking over me/whatevs", and give them time to mull it over.
The ball is in your court.
Once you put a fence and gate up, he's very much on the back foot. Fait accomplis are powerful things.

OP, if you want to get on with the neighbour then totally disregard all the above. Its just going to be inflammatory and will result in you living next door to someone you are at war with. Do you want to sit in your garden on a Sunday afternoon whilst next door deliberately have music on loud? Probably not, so much better to take a sensible approach than an aggressive  one and sort it out like reasonable adults. That way you find a mutual way to resolve things and you dont knock thousands off the value of your house.

Or you can do as ThisIsWierd suggests and spend the next few years snarling at each other.

ThisIsWeird

Well, it can't be said the OP doesn't have options.
Swingaloo, could you explain your 'sensible' approach please.

swingaloo

ThisIsWeird said:

Well, it can't be said the OP doesn't have options.
Swingaloo, could you explain your 'sensible' approach please.

Well as others have said, the first thing to do is check out the deeds for both properties and establish exactly who can go where. Then once armed with the full correct facts have an adult discussion with the neighbour and find a compromise that suits both.  
On the same topic, could you explain the need to show certain words in bold and others in italics.