HMRC incorrectly state that we've claimed UC via a partially completed online form?

Algorithm_Blues

Perhaps... however, HMRC have now sent a second letter that claims our 'child tax benefits' were stopped on the exact date that I supposedly clicked the immutable 'Submit Claim' button (around mid February) approximately -  six weeks before my migration notice.

Consequently, I now have a second overpayment summons for £250. Essentially putting me £850 in debt for simply sketching in a few details, as a precursor to fully completing the online application form closer to our migration date! So, not a 'red herring' and it will certainly make a difference to our family finances.

As I'm here, i noticed a poster decided to highlight the fact that I'd used the term "underhand" in one of my comments - which I did. However, by using the specific quote - where I'd essentially admitted my language was over the top - as an opportunity to deliver their uninformed assumptions and passive aggressive statements - isn't what I expected when simply looking for some clarification of what I see as an ambiguous grey area.   

peteuk

Newcad said:

Just to be absolutely clear here:

I do accept that the OP may not have actually clicked the 'Submit Claim' button and submitted the claim.

But that whole argument is a Red Herring - it makes no difference here.

The Managed Migration notice is primarily a notice that your Tax Credits (and/or any legacy IR benefits) will end on a certain date.
It also tells you that if you choose to claim UC instead then special 'Transitional' rules will apply to that claim if made before the notified date.

Whether you choose to claim UC or not is your choice, but whatever choice you make the Tax Credits (and/or legacy benefits) still end on the notified date.

They don't end because you have claimed UC - you claim UC (or not) because they are ending.

If TCs (and/or legacy benefits) continue to be paid after that notified date then that is an error and an overpayment.

I believe the over payment is the period between applying for UC, declining it and then the run off of their TC.  So in theory the claim for UC should have ended the TC.  Because the OP thought he hadn’t fully applied for UC then they didn’t question the run out period of TC. 

Of course what we dont know is to what extent the overpayment full is.  This could have occurred anyway regardless of the migration letter but the natural assumption is it was caused by the UC application.

peteuk

Algorithm_Blues said:

Perhaps... however, HMRC have now sent a second letter that claims our 'child tax benefits' were stopped on the exact date that I supposedly clicked the immutable 'Submit Claim' button (around mid February) approximately -  six weeks before my migration notice.

Consequently, I now have a second overpayment summons for £250. Essentially putting me £850 in debt for simply sketching in a few details, as a precursor to fully completing the online application form closer to our migration date! So, not a 'red herring' and it will certainly make a difference to our family finances.

As I'm here, i noticed a poster decided to highlight the fact that I'd used the term "underhand" in one of my comments - which I did. However, by using the specific quote - where I'd essentially admitted my language was over the top - as an opportunity to deliver their uninformed assumptions and passive aggressive statements - isn't what I expected when simply looking for some clarification of what I see as an ambiguous grey area.   

Just for clarity, the OP pulled me up for using the word underhand and then i highlighted that they had used it first.  Sadly if you do come to this board, we aren’t always going to give you the answer you want to hear.   Now if there was a flood of people who had the same problem then i would say its a glitch and the OP and others are more then entitled to complain and naturally distressed. But thee isn’t.

I like many others can't  work out how you managed to claim UC without submitting a claim, nor do I understand how you can’t realise you've done so.  There is, in my opinion no great area.  On applying for UC your TC should have stopped.  I totally understand if you think you haven't applied for UC then youd expect your TC to continue.  (Given that it was so close to the end of the financial year). And indeed if you look back a few months there has been a host of “when’s the best date to apply” as people try and work out what would be the best for them. 

Having built up an overpayment through no fault of my own, and having HMRC blame me, I totally understand the OPs frustration. And yes we are still paying it off. 

Now interestingly the second letter, which suggests to me the first letter may have been an end of tax year review, in which case is absolutely nothing to do with the UC application.  The second one is due to the UC application.

@Algorithm_Blues as you are not currently claiming any benefits then DWP/HMRC can not claim the overpayment back through these,  I have seen people on this board note that until it goes to debt management there is nothing you can do (which also makes no sense) you can set up a payment scheme which pushes the overpayment to an endless amount of payments, you set the amount you can afford.  

I would `check the dates on the letters, it should be clear the dates you claimed TC.  Dont forget that TC is reviewed at the end of the tax year and overpayments then brought to light.   If you claimed UC then you would have an in year end of TC review. If this is the case then the first letter has nothing to do with your UC claim, it is simply an overpayment.  If it is an end of year (April to April) then the letter suggests you havent claimed UC, with the second letter correcting this.

TC is a sum of money, split into 13 payments.  In theory if the discrepancy is such, that it takes away your entitlement to TC then the payments for the whole year is classed as an overpayment.  Eg you get a promotion in September and the wage rise is significant, then TC doesnt just stop it works out your not entitled and then the overpayment is everything from April to Sep.