TUI Airways Cancellation / Delay Compensation

Lukejhull

Hi,

Seeking a little advice - Just returned home from a 13 night trip to Dominican With TUI as a package holiday 

Everything went well apart from the day we were mean to leave Punta Cana 17th 17:30 Local Time. We were picked up from our hotel at 14:00 but received an email at 13:21 stating our flight had been cancelled due to crew sickness. we were instructed to still travel to airport and seek assistance when we arrived, TUI spoke with us and had organised 3x hotels for an overnight stay and was trying to get the flight away by 12:00 on the 18th.

Transport to and from hotels provided and back to the airport on the 18th but flight did not leave until 13:28 and landed back in Manchester at 02:04 local time causing a delay of 19 hours 47 minutes according to tui email

when i filled the form out for airline compensation they have replied stating under European regulations EC 261/2004 stating airlines are to pay compensation over 3 hours but only if delay wasn't caused by extraordinary circumstances and they then state they have investigated  our claim for delay of 19 hours 21 minutes and states logs show medical issue with our Captain operating our flight (which had been known about before the scheduled flight)

stated a new crew member operated out and took minimum rest before operating flight back to Manchester (however the captain on our flight home said he was already in the Dominican on a flight from Birmingham but had had sufficient rest so he wasn't flown out just to deal with our flight)

then go onto state There European Commission has recently published draft guidelines as to what amounts to extraordinary circumstances, This list was prepared with the assistance of the various national bodies reasonable for regulating the aviation industry across Europe. in this draft the commission has intimated that the following would be considered extraordinary circumstances: 16. Medical grounds "passenger or crew member becomes seriously ill or dies on-board at short notice before the flight." an operating air carrier shall not be obliged to pay compensation in accordance with Article 7, if it can prove the delay is caused by extraordinary circumstances  which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken.having investigated into the reasons for the delay to your flight, i can confirm that the circumstances surrounding the delay to your flight are classified as extraordinary  circumstances under Regulation 261/2004 of the European union 

obviously we were well looked after by TUI etc and hope it was nothing serious with the crew member and hope they are ok but seems there's always a loophole these companies how to avoid paying out for whats right or are they just using regulations and wording to scare people off taking it further

any advice appreciated but if nothing can be done they it is what it is

mdann52

This is currently in front of the UK Supreme Court in the case of Lipton v BA Cityflyer. Until the decision is heard in this case, you are unlikely to get this case dealt with, which is deciding whether the Court of Appeals decision that crew sickness isn't an extraordinary circumstance.

However, if this is their final position, TUI are a member of AviationADR, so there's no harm launching a case with them.

Lukejhull

mdann52 said:

This is currently in front of the UK Supreme Court in the case of Lipton v BA Cityflyer. Until the decision is heard in this case, you are unlikely to get this case dealt with, which is deciding whether the Court of Appeals decision that crew sickness isn't an extraordinary circumstance.

However, if this is their final position, TUI are a member of AviationADR, so there's no harm launching a case with them.

Thank you 

Westin

BA don’t have a crew base in Punta Cana.  By using an inbound flight deck member from another (BHX) flight, and getting them to fly back on your service with minimum rest, was probably the only thing they could do to minimise your disruption.  That probably fulfils their obligation to do all they can to avoid a lengthier delay.

Voyager2002

You should be able to look up the time when the flight from Birmingham arrived, and therefore the earliest time after that when the crew member had had the minimum required rest. Does that give you your actual departure time? If not, and if the additional delay amounts to three hours, that might form the basis for a claim.

Lukejhull

Westin said:

BA don’t have a crew base in Punta Cana.  By using an inbound flight deck member from another (BHX) flight, and getting them to fly back on your service with minimum rest, was probably the only thing they could do to minimise your disruption.  That probably fulfils their obligation to do all they can to avoid a lengthier delay.

Yes they did do everything quite quickly considering the factors and im happy with how they handled everything just if entitled to compensation i just woudn't want to miss out on it - money is money end of the day

Lukejhull

Voyager2002 said:

You should be able to look up the time when the flight from Birmingham arrived, and therefore the earliest time after that when the crew member had had the minimum required rest. Does that give you your actual departure time? If not, and if the additional delay amounts to three hours, that might form the basis for a claim.

from what i knew with tracking the flights 2x flights arrived on the 17th from UK
First 1 from Manchester which was the airplane we was meant to fly back on arrived at Punta Cana at 14:59 but left same day but Flew back to Birmingham at 17:37

The Inbound From Birmingham Arrived at 14:47 and plane stayed overnight as that's the one we flew back to Manchester on - The pilot addressed us on the flight and stated he had arrived on the Birmingham flight on the 17th and was meant to have another day in Punta Cana but since he had the minimum rest in the hotel and night before he was allowed to fly home if he chose to help out otherwise we would of been stuck another day

We took off Punta Cana on the 18th at 13:20 and arrived back at manchester at 02:04 on the 18th

Hoenir

Voyager2002 said:

You should be able to look up the time when the flight from Birmingham arrived, and therefore the earliest time after that when the crew member had had the minimum required rest. Does that give you your actual departure time? If not, and if the additional delay amounts to three hours, that might form the basis for a claim.

Planes don't just take off and land at will. 

Westin

Lukejhull said:

Westin said:

BA don’t have a crew base in Punta Cana.  By using an inbound flight deck member from another (BHX) flight, and getting them to fly back on your service with minimum rest, was probably the only thing they could do to minimise your disruption.  That probably fulfils their obligation to do all they can to avoid a lengthier delay.

Yes they did do everything quite quickly considering the factors and im happy with how they handled everything just if entitled to compensation i just woudn't want to miss out on it - money is money end of the day

I don’t see compo due or payable - as per the explanation that TUI has given you. 

Lukejhull

Westin said:

Lukejhull said:

Westin said:

BA don’t have a crew base in Punta Cana.  By using an inbound flight deck member from another (BHX) flight, and getting them to fly back on your service with minimum rest, was probably the only thing they could do to minimise your disruption.  That probably fulfils their obligation to do all they can to avoid a lengthier delay.

Yes they did do everything quite quickly considering the factors and im happy with how they handled everything just if entitled to compensation i just woudn't want to miss out on it - money is money end of the day

I don’t see compo due or payable - as per the explanation that TUI has given you. 

maybe not but as somebody states its in supreme court right now awaiting a decision so worth a shot when as much as £500+ PP maybe payable - if not then not going to go crazy about it but if up for grabs woudn't want to miss out 

also believe if they can say crew sickness is a way out of paying compensation as a extraordinary circumstance then they will just says that's the case all the time for a number of things that go wrong in the industry 

Hoenir

Lukejhull said:

Westin said:

Lukejhull said:

Westin said:

BA don’t have a crew base in Punta Cana.  By using an inbound flight deck member from another (BHX) flight, and getting them to fly back on your service with minimum rest, was probably the only thing they could do to minimise your disruption.  That probably fulfils their obligation to do all they can to avoid a lengthier delay.

Yes they did do everything quite quickly considering the factors and im happy with how they handled everything just if entitled to compensation i just woudn't want to miss out on it - money is money end of the day

I don’t see compo due or payable - as per the explanation that TUI has given you. 

also believe if they can say crew sickness is a way out of paying compensation as a extraordinary circumstance then they will just says that's the case all the time for a number of things that go wrong in the industry 

People increasingly want something for nothing these days then complain when the price of everything rises to unaffordable levels.