Diesel Scrappage Scheme

400ixl

jimjames said:

400ixl said:

With the diesel scrappage scheme you were not placing the money with the dealer, the government was. So you were trading in your car for a government funded contribution. 

As per the link above, this was NOT a government scheme so there was no money from the government.

Then it was a manufacturer contribution like any other they often have. Same thing in the context I was trying to make of it not being a deposit in the sense of a trade in.

UnkownUser2024

400ixl said:

jimjames said:

400ixl said:

With the diesel scrappage scheme you were not placing the money with the dealer, the government was. So you were trading in your car for a government funded contribution. 

As per the link above, this was NOT a government scheme so there was no money from the government.

Then it was a manufacturer contribution like any other they often have. Same thing in the context I was trying to make of it not being a deposit in the sense of a trade in.

I can agree that it was then a manufacturer contribution, but by virtue of me part exchanging my vehicle. In which case it has to be recognised that the transaction was a part exchange and therefore a deposit. 

Otherwise I could have kept my car and still negotiated a further £7,000 off the price? 

Okell

@UnknownUser2024 -  how far do you want to pursue this?  Is it something you really have to do or is it just a point of principle - correcting an injustice done to you by VWFS?

As others have said you really need paid for professional legal advice.  If you can't afford it you probably can't afford to continue pursuing this.

If you do really want to continue you could try posting on Legal Beagles here:  Vehicle Finance and Issues - LegalBeagles Forum.   Several of the members there are current or retired lawyers.

The other place you could perhaps try is Consumer Action Group:  either here Financial Legal Issues - Consumer Action Group or here General Legal Issues - Consumer Action Group

UnkownUser2024

@UnknownUser2024 -  how far do you want to pursue this?  Is it something you really have to do or is it just a point of principle - correcting an injustice done to you by VWFS?

As others have said you really need paid for professional legal advice.  If you can't afford it you probably can't afford to continue pursuing this.

If you do really want to continue you could try posting on Legal Beagles here: 
  Several of the members there are current or retired lawyers.

The other place you could perhaps try is Consumer Action Group:  either here or here

Hi, I have been receiving advice from legal beagles since the set aside of the CCJ, and was advised by a retired vehicle finance lawyer on there to pursue this and file a counter claim

For this reason I want to pursue it as the lawyers on there are adamant that I have a valid case and have been served an injustice. 

I will check out the financial legal issues group and consumer action group, thank you for posting these 

Herzlos

UnkownUser2024 said:

400ixl said:

jimjames said:

400ixl said:

With the diesel scrappage scheme you were not placing the money with the dealer, the government was. So you were trading in your car for a government funded contribution. 

As per the link above, this was NOT a government scheme so there was no money from the government.

Then it was a manufacturer contribution like any other they often have. Same thing in the context I was trying to make of it not being a deposit in the sense of a trade in.

I can agree that it was then a manufacturer contribution, but by virtue of me part exchanging my vehicle. In which case it has to be recognised that the transaction was a part exchange and therefore a deposit. 

Otherwise I could have kept my car and still negotiated a further £7,000 off the price? 

They probably could have let you keep the car and given you a £7k discount if you'd pressed hard enough.

What was the trade in worth? That's the only value flowing from you to Audi, and the difference is a discount (though you could argue it's a deposit if the paperwork call it a deposit contribution).

How much do you owe at this point?

UnkownUser2024

Herzlos said:

UnkownUser2024 said:

400ixl said:

jimjames said:

400ixl said:

With the diesel scrappage scheme you were not placing the money with the dealer, the government was. So you were trading in your car for a government funded contribution. 

As per the link above, this was NOT a government scheme so there was no money from the government.

Then it was a manufacturer contribution like any other they often have. Same thing in the context I was trying to make of it not being a deposit in the sense of a trade in.

I can agree that it was then a manufacturer contribution, but by virtue of me part exchanging my vehicle. In which case it has to be recognised that the transaction was a part exchange and therefore a deposit. 

Otherwise I could have kept my car and still negotiated a further £7,000 off the price? 

They probably could have let you keep the car and given you a £7k discount if you'd pressed hard enough.

What was the trade in worth? That's the only value flowing from you to Audi, and the difference is a discount (though you could argue it's a deposit if the paperwork call it a deposit contribution).

How much do you owe at this point?

The trade in was never valued at its true value. It was valued at 7k against a new Audi A6

I'd already received a 6k discount on top of the 7k part exchange. Incidentally it actually states in the terms and conditions that you can't combine the discounts. 

At this point Judgment is to the Claimant for 11k plus 5k legal costs. So if an appeal costs me a few more thousand at this point it doesn't make much of a difference as long as I have a good chance of over turning the decision

Phoenix72

Can't help myself but the trade in was not valued at £7k - a fixed discount was offered to scrap a car, regardless of value. The only condition seems to be that you owned the old car for 6 months?

To me, that is no different to any discount negotiated and such discounts do not form part of the amount payable in the credit agreement.

VWFS seem confident, you seem equally sure (although you occasionally say I'm not sure). Is there not a danger any costs could spiral if you appeal and lose again?

UnkownUser2024

Phoenix72 said:

Can't help myself but the trade in was not valued at £7k - a fixed discount was offered to scrap a car, regardless of value. The only condition seems to be that you owned the old car for 6 months?

To me, that is no different to any discount negotiated and such discounts do not form part of the amount payable in the credit agreement.

VWFS seem confident, you seem equally sure (although you occasionally say I'm not sure). Is there not a danger any costs could spiral if you appeal and lose again?

I can't tell if you're trying to help or just be critical. 

I'm not sure, hence asking on here and hopefully receiving some sound advice. 

A discount is still by virtue a deposit and for that reason I believe that the legislation should have been abide by and the case needs revisiting. I'm already in this deep, it makes no odds now if further costs are added when there is a chance that with the right representation and in front of the right judge I could overturn the decision 

Phoenix72

UnkownUser2024 said:

Phoenix72 said:

Can't help myself but the trade in was not valued at £7k - a fixed discount was offered to scrap a car, regardless of value. The only condition seems to be that you owned the old car for 6 months?

To me, that is no different to any discount negotiated and such discounts do not form part of the amount payable in the credit agreement.

VWFS seem confident, you seem equally sure (although you occasionally say I'm not sure). Is there not a danger any costs could spiral if you appeal and lose again?

I can't tell if you're trying to help or just be critical. 

I'm not sure, hence asking on here and hopefully receiving some sound advice. 

A discount is still by virtue a deposit and for that reason I believe that the legislation should have been abide by and the case needs revisiting. I'm already in this deep, it makes no odds now if further costs are added when there is a chance that with the right representation and in front of the right judge I could overturn the decision 

Just saying you have went from saying quite unequivocally the judge has misinterpreted the law to "I'm not sure" - those 2 statements are contradictory.

I still disagree that a discount is a deposit, if I walk into a dealer tomorrow and haggle £5k off a £40k I'm buying a car for £35k, not £40k with a notional £5k deposit.

Anyway, we'll agree to disagree. Has there been a written judgement so people can see exactly the judge said?

jimjames

UnkownUser2024 said:

Phoenix72 said:

Can't help myself but the trade in was not valued at £7k - a fixed discount was offered to scrap a car, regardless of value. The only condition seems to be that you owned the old car for 6 months?

To me, that is no different to any discount negotiated and such discounts do not form part of the amount payable in the credit agreement.

VWFS seem confident, you seem equally sure (although you occasionally say I'm not sure). Is there not a danger any costs could spiral if you appeal and lose again?

A discount is still by virtue a deposit and for that reason I believe that the legislation should have been abide by and the case needs revisiting. I'm already in this deep, it makes no odds now if further costs are added when there is a chance that with the right representation and in front of the right judge I could overturn the decision 

If you look at another purchase type it may help clarify. Buying a house requires a deposit. If you negotiate a £5k reduction in the sale price then it doesn't mean you now have a £5k deposit, it just means the price is lower.